Oh, not another Recovery question!

[sagara]

I've looked up previous posts that might deal with this problem - but ...

I'm replacing a T42 Raedon 7500 XGA with a newly bought T42 Raedon 9600 SXGA off ebay (specs otherwise the same). A friend is buying the XGA T42. I thought I'd just swap the HDDs over (all my stuff was on the XGA T42, the SXGA T42 is in initial factory state). This swap worked OK after installing the ATI video drivers for the 9600. But I want my friend's XGA T42 to be able to restore to the factory contents if need be. But the HDD now in the XGA T42 does not have a Recovery Partition, but the older HPA version, and the SXGA T42 where it was taken from did not come with the Recovery Disks.

When it tried to do a 'Restore Factory Content' (Access IBM/Rescue & Recovery/Restore Factory Contents) on the XGA T42 (with the HDD that came with the SXGA T42), it goes into DOS mode, starting with 'Starting Windows 98', creates a RAM drive D:\ but ends up with -

Path not found - C:\COUNTRY\RECOVCC.DEF
File not found - C:\ COUNTRY\RECOVCC.DEF
Label not found

The D:\ RAM drive lists two directors: RECOVERY and COUNTRY

Looking in COUNTRY there are 'promising files' such as CC.BAT, COUNTRY.BAT, RECOVCC.DEF (listed as above as missing in C:\). And in RECOVERY some beginning with RECOVCC.*

On the C:\ drive there is a directory labelled RECOVERY, which has loads of files like *.PSA, *.CRI, *.IM2, etc.

Where to go from here?

I put this HDD back where it came from (T42 SXGA), with exactly the same results. It's as if all the bits are there but in the wrong place!

I do have a set of Recovery Disks made with the XGA T42 - and I understand that it would work in another T42. But does this effect warranty (both have at least 1 years warranty left, but my 'newer' SXGA T42 has its origin in the USA, and only a Limited Warranty, which isn't much good over here in the UK).

I've also looked at downloading the 'Rescue and Recovery' program, but that way seems more trouble than it's worth!

Any nice, patient person out there help?

[Harryc]

Use the recovery CD's. It won't effect the warranty as long as you have an XP COA on the XGA machine.

[carbon_unit]

Yep, save off the data you want to keep and rremove the partitions on the hard drive. Then run the recovery cd's and they will create the recovery partition and install windows for you. Then the onboard recovery will work later too.

[sagara]

Great. Thanks for that. All that apparent fuss and a simple solution!

[sagara]

Have just tried to use the 7 Recovery CDs created on the 'old' T42 to restore the 'new' T42 to original factory contents, but it has turned out a disaster!

Firstly, I enter the BIOS setup and disabled the HPA hidden 'partion'. Then rebooted with the RECOVERY BOOT disc. It loads up and gives me a menu. Under RECOVERY & RESTORE, I select RESTORE FACTORY CONTENTS, then a message appears 'In Order to Proceed, your system must be rebooted, do you want to continue?' I say YES. The message appears: PLEASE REMOVE ALL DISKETTES, CD MEDIA ... POWER OFF THE SYSTEM AND REBOOT. When I say YES, this message comes up: DEBUG ASSERTION FAILED! PROGRAM G\:i386\SYSTEM 32\ OEMWIPE.exe

I RETRY and it all locks up. When I reboot I enter RESCUE AND RECOVERY and end up with a similar menu, but without RESTORE FACTORY CONTENTS - so I choose RESORE FROM BACKUP - but this is obviously not a real choice - it asks for disc labelled 'FINAL C', and whatever of my 6 Recovery discs I put it, it does not register.

So my T42 is stuck with continually booting up to this last Rescue & Restore screen, and there it remains.

If I just reformat the entire drive and start again, will this make any difference - somehow I don't think so! What a mess. At times like this I wish I were rich, so I can just take throw the machine ouit the window! But I'm not rich ...

[richk]

I have had trouble restoring T42 over a disk that had already had a recovery partition. Here is what I have done:

Disable the predesktop area (which you did). Start DFT or some other disk utility from a floppy or CD. Use some sort of erase program to completely clear the disk. Recover.

[al7kz]

delete

[sagara]

OK, I think the simplest solution is as suggested: to reformat the HDD, and try again from scratch. Perhaps that will also bypass that 'Win98' stuff!

Interestingly, the HDD has ended up with FOUR partirtions:

D: [FAT32 - 502MB
E: [UNKNOWN (probably NTFS)] - 502MB
F: as above - 36656MB
C: (IBM_SERVICE) [FAT32] - 495MB

Thanks for your help. Let's see if I can find some bootable CD or floppy that will do the reformat (long time since I did this!).

[andyP]

You can use IBM SDD to delete the hard drive. You can download it and create a bootable cd (iso) or floppy, here's where you can get it:

http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... d=TVAN-SDD

I always use it and it works great. Using it at the lowest level deletes the mbr and the first and last sectors of the drive. The result is the recovery cds then think it is a "new" and "naked" drive. Never failed me.

[sagara]

So far - success!!! The reformat worked - first Boot disc worked; now on Recovery Disc 1 and it's still going. Will get back when it finishes! Thanks to you all!

[sagara]

Spoke too soon! It gets as far as loading the Boot disc, and then the first Recovery CD. When Recovery disc 1 finishes, it says

YOU MUST RESTART YOUR COMPUTER TO COMPLETE PROCESS. DO YOU WANT TO RESTART TO COMPLETE?

It says nothing about removing Recovery Disc 1 or putting in Disc 2. So I say YES, take out Recovery disc 1, and reboot. Then it loads 'Rescue and Recovery' and ends up at the initial screen I started with and no where to go!

Where has INSERT DISC 2 gone. So left going round in circles!!!

[andyP]

@sagara
put the recovery disc 1 back in and start the machine. (The recovery process was, if I remember rightly, a bit strange for the T41.)
It may be you will have to start over Is the cd / dvd drive set as first boot device in BIOS?

It says nothing about removing Recovery Disc 1 or putting in Disc 2. So I say YES, take out Recovery disc 1, and reboot.

This was possibly your mistake. It always says when to remove a cd and don't be surprised if it asks for disk 2 and then after a while wants disk 1 again.

[al7kz]

As I recall when I did it, that first CD is just the Rescue and Recovery with Rapid Restore program. After that installs to the drive, then you reboot and pick "restore factory contents", then it has you feed in CD's 2 to 7.

[andyP]

As I recall when I did it, that first CD is just the Rescue and Recovery with Rapid Restore program. After that installs to the drive, then you reboot and pick "restore factory contents", then it has you feed in CD's 2 to 7.

That is correct for later ThinkPads, I think from T43 / R51 etc. The T41 as far as I can remember has a set of 5 or 6 cds without a separate boot cd. I'll check in the morning as I have a set, but not where I am now.

[sagara]

I started at the beginning again, with a reformat, and this time after Recovery disc 1 was 'finished', when asked to reboot I left Recovery Disc 1 in the CD drive. It rebooted, then I arrived at the initial Rescue & Recovery screen, went through two more choices screens (same as at the beginning), but ended with a screen saying IBM PRODUCT RECOVERY FAILED DURING CONVERSION PHASE. So this seems like a dead end?

[andyP]

I'm sorry, but I've never seen that error before and can only think of one thing, is the cd drive definitely set as first boot device in BIOS? If the hard drive and cds are OK, (clean), there is no reason for it to fail. If that is the case then I'm just as puzzled as you

[sagara]

Yes, the CD/DVD drive is the first boot drive. The CDs were created last month on new good quality Cds, and none have marks, etc. I find iot strange that it is fine with the first Recovery boot disk, and with the first Recovery disc, then it fails!

I think I might go back to my old ways and just do a clean install with my old XP disc, then install all the IBM drivers.

[richk]

That is the kind of error I've seen when the disk isn't erased. (removing partitions and mbr isn't enough) I assume you set predesktop area to disabled, then erased the disk, then set predesktop to normal before starting the recovery. That is the correct order.

[GomJabbar]

That is the kind of error I've seen when the disk isn't erased. (removing partitions and mbr isn't enough) I assume you set predesktop area to disabled, then erased the disk, then set predesktop to normal before starting the recovery. That is the correct order.

Exactly correct. When you actually use the Recovery Discs, make sure the security for the Predesktop Area is set to Normal. Sometimes the hard drive needs to be erased or zeroed out before the Recovery Discs will work.

When you choose to Restore Factory Contents from the Product Recovery Disc set, after some files are copied from the CD's, you are told to remove the CD and reboot. The system reboots back into Rescue and Recovery. You have to choose to Restore Factory Contents again. This time all the files are on the hard drive to implement the actual restore.

EDIT: See following thread: Product Recovery does not function

Yeah, fdisk was too weak, the low level format was the solution.

[sagara]

Ah. I did not set predesktop back to normal after erasing the disk. Also, I was using my XP disk to delete all patitions and then reformat, but perhaps this will not give me a clean enough disk. Anyway, it's bed time over this side of the Atlantic. But I can't find my old Boot disk with the Format program, etc. It's years since I used it. I downloaded the SDD prog. as someone suggested, but then it talks about creating an image - something else to learn!

But next step is a clean format and then put predesktop back to normal, then proceed with recovery disk!

Goodnight and thanks.

[GomJabbar]

See the edit in my post above. Windows Fdisk and Windows Format are not sufficient.

[al7kz]

deleted

[sagara]

Looked at the 'edit above', and it seems clear that a really clean format is necessary. I have IBM disk Manager on CD on floplpy, but as this 'IBM' HDD is a Fujitsu HDD, it refused to erase it - it wants a Hitachi HDD! The 'edit above' does give a link to Fujitsu and I have downloaded the prog [fjrase.zip] that will do a proper clean format easing masterboot records, etc. But I have to create a 'clean Dos disk', then I have somehow to run this fjrase prog. Here I'm lost. I can handle Kant's Transcendental Deduction, etc. - but here I'm out of my depth! From what I've heard others say, does this mean I have to create an CD with an 'image' so that it will boot, and somehow get this fjrase prog and the CD? LOST!

Anyway, I've a busy two days ahead and then I'm of for a week. So I will try again when I get back.

I do appreciate all this help. Perhaps I'm really a MAC type!

[GomJabbar]

I did this like a year ago. IIRC, I downloaded and created the Hitachi Drive Fitness Test floppy. I then copied the Fujitsu files to the floppy and modified the autoexec.bat file to point to the Fujitsu executable. I may have had to delete some of the Hitachi files from the floppy to make enough room for the Fujitsu files. Don't remember.

I believe you can also use a Windows 98 Startup disk and copy the Fujitsu files to that disk. Use Windows Notepad to edit the autoexec.bat file if necessary.

[sagara]

That sounds a good idea. I'll try it when I get back.

[sagara]

GomJabbar - I did what you said - put the fjerase.exe from Fijutsu on my Hitachi DISK MANAGER floppy, booted with it and it works! Well, not finally: got as far as the prompt F4 ERASE, but left it there fort the time being. I've stuck a clean install of XP SP2 on with enough IBM stuff so that I can use it while I'm away - but I don't have the time to do a clean format and see if all the Recovery Discs will get through - if it fails then I'll be stuck for time. But thanks for that little tip.

[sagara]

Coundn't resist the temptation! Formated HDD with fjerase. It took 2 1/2 hours. But when I tried the Recovery phase, the end result was the same: loads up the boot disk fine, then asks for disk 1, and that goes OK until I end up with exactly the same error message I had before: IBM PRODUCT RECOVERY FAILED DURING CONVERSION PHASE.

So as this is IBM hardware and software, and the m/c is still under warranty, I'll contact IBM when I get back. I think it is now their problem!

[GomJabbar]

I think what could be the problem here is the HPA. It is unclear to me if your T42 SGXA+ uses HPA or not. There is also the possibility that your Recovery CD's are damaged or corrupted.

If your Recovery CD's were designed for HPA only, then that could be a problem on a non-HPA system.

Here is some information that may or may not be helpful to you regarding restoring the HPA.
ftp://ftp.software.ibm.com/pc/pccbbs/ac ... a_aibm.pdf

FTR, I have used the Recovery CD's successfully on my T42 that has the FAT32 Service Partition. I have not tried to recover a system with the HPA.

[sagara]

I'm away from my laptops for a week, but the Recovery CDs were made on an XGA T42, which is non-HPA. But I am trying to use them on a SXGA T42, which is HPA (slightly earlier model). Is the BIOS different on these T42s? That might explain the problem. Thanks for the page on HPA.

[GomJabbar]

That's an idea. I didn't think about the BIOS differences. Why don't you try updating the BIOS and Embedded Controller to the latest versions?