75% of the people who download Firefox don't use it

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mattbiernat · #1 Post by **mattbiernat** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 1:48 am

Mozilla, the organisation behind the Firefox browser, is asking for help. It says: "we need to improve our ability to retain users".
August 8, 2007 7:30 PM
According to the Mozilla wiki: "In order for Firefox to reach our market share goals, we need to improve our ability to retain users. Currently, approximately 50% of the people who download Firefox actually try it and about 50% of those people continue to use it actively."

Firefox's claims to success have been supported by clocking up the number of downloads, encouraged by payments from Google, but it turns out that 75% of the people making those downloads don't "continue to use it actively."

Mozilla also has a 12-point plan to increase retention levels, though it's actually an 11-point plan with one item repeated.

Well, I'm not convinced that 25% is such a bad figure. I remove at least 90% of the programs I download and try, often within seconds. Sturgeon's Law applies.

But Mozilla does have a real problem, which is that the days of easy pickings are over. Microsoft's IE7 works well and so far hasn't had the sort of security problems that afflicted IE6. (In fact, Firefox suffered from more vulnerabilities than IE, in 2006, according to IBM.)

It also has competition from Apple's Steve Jobs, who has publicly committed to wiping Firefox out. Whether he's just blowing smoke remains to be seen.

Frankly, the 12-point plan doesn't seem to offer much of real value (ZDnet has made some comments on the ideas). Nor does spending big bundles of cash on TV advertising. If you have any other ideas, they need them over at the Mozilla wiki.

Every Windows user has benefitted from Firefox -- even the ones who didn't download it -- because it forced Microsoft to get off its rear end, improve the product and compete for users.

Netscape folded because its marketing strategy was a shambles, and because it couldn't keep up with Microsoft's product development. (Netscape abandoned v5 and gave the code away to Mozilla; Netscape 6 was rubbish.) Now Redmond is back on the road, it would be a terrible shame if Mozilla went the same way.

Guys, you are not going to win by "1. Change the Firefox icon label to closer resemble action of getting to web". You need to build a better product and come up with a better marketing strategy. Preferably soon.

source: long link reduced to avoid scrolling with i.e.

#2 Post by **rkawakami** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 2:17 am

Well, count me among the ones who download Firefox AND actively use it on all my machines. The only time I use IE is for Windows updates, otherwise it's purpose is to waste the 70-odd square pixels on my desktop.

Yes Firefox is somewhat of a memory hog. Yes it sometimes locks up (but that might be more to do with my Adobe Acrobat installation). Yes the Java Console got broken recently with one of the latest updates. But it still is worth running instead of IE (IMO).

#3 Post by **gator** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 2:42 am

rkawakami wrote:Yes Firefox is somewhat of a memory hog. Yes it sometimes locks up (but that might be more to do with my Adobe Acrobat installation). Yes the Java Console got broken recently with one of the latest updates. But it still is worth running instead of IE (IMO).

Ray, have you tried Opera? I "switched" to it after troubles with FF2, sometime last year and been very happy with it. The latest version (9.2 .something I think) might be a bit of a hog, try using version 7 or 8 from www.oldversion.com. That is what I run on my 600X and it is awesome.

#4 Post by **rkawakami** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 3:17 am

I tried Opera way back when Netscape still ruled the browser market. Had a bug in it which caused some, but not all, images to be flipped 180 degrees (left to right, not up and down). While it seemed to work okay otherwise, I never used the later versions. Been happy with Netscape, Mozilla and Firefox.

kensplace · #5 Post by **kensplace** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 4:33 am

If your a web developer, firefox is great if you install the firebug addon

Really useful addon....

#6 Post by **GomJabbar** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 12:23 pm

I'm with Gator. I have been using Opera almost exclusively the past year. I don't even have Firefox on my system anymore. I use IE7 for updates and the occasional site that requires it.

Opera just came out with a new version 9.23 a few days ago. My connection has been slow, so I haven't downloaded and installed it yet. I am still at version 9.22.

BTW, I have not noticed any image flipping problem. The earliest version of Opera that I have used was 8.54 if I am not mistaken.

#7 Post by **rkawakami** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 12:56 pm

I'm sure that bug was squashed a long time ago. We're talking 1998-99 I think, when I first/last used Opera.

#8 Post by **jdhurst** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 2:25 pm

Vendors are becoming notorius for counting "window shopping" as "confirmed usage". I recently purchased a license for Office 2003, a CD for Office 2003 and paid for Office 2003. I was shipped a key for Office 2003 from Microsoft. Microsoft recorded it as an Office 2007 purchase. It was not. This practice borders on deliberate corporate lying to try to prove their inaccurate assertions. ... JDH

#9 Post by **tomh009** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 2:43 pm

gator wrote:Ray, have you tried Opera? I "switched" to it after troubles with FF2, sometime last year and been very happy with it. The latest version (9.2 .something I think) might be a bit of a hog, try using version 7 or 8 from www.oldversion.com. That is what I run on my 600X and it is awesome.

I spent a bit of time looking around on the Opera site, but did not discover any compelling reasons to switch from Firefox. Some nice things, yes, but ... no extensions library (IE Tab, Translate and Flashblock alone are priceless), no user themes (as far as I could find), and Opera is still niche enough that web sites don't necessarily get tested for compatibility with it.

No doubt it works well for many people, but I can't see why I would take the time to get a third browser onto my system. (The only lockups I get are with occasional PDF documents -- and killing acrobat.exe gets Firefox working again.)

#10 Post by **Kyocera** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 3:04 pm

I have to claim I'm one of those 75%

Downloaded it a long time ago, liked it but alas, had to (lazy) use IE for certain work related functions, i.e. setting up routers, printers, etc.

I have recommended it to those who manage to get IE corrupted or trojanized. So I am an advocate of FireFox to that extent.

macuser · #11 Post by **macuser** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 3:04 pm

I use it exclusively on the mac.

#12 Post by **Kyocera** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 3:06 pm

macuser wrote:I use it exclusively on the mac.

Don't like Safari? I kind of like certain features of Safari, myself.

#13 Post by **rkawakami** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 3:22 pm

tomh009 wrote:(The only lockups I get are with occasional PDF documents -- and killing acrobat.exe gets Firefox working again.)

Hey you too?

I'm running a "pre-release" version of Adobe Acrobat Professional 6.0 on my system and I've attributed that reason to my FF lock-ups. Haven't yet tried installing the latest free Reader to see if that would cure it, but I like being able to print to a .PDF file from any application.

DarkMark · #14 Post by **DarkMark** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 3:39 pm

With me the crashing of Firefox stopped as soon as I installed version 8 of the acrobat reader. Before then I never ever used Firefox to look at pdfs, now I even sometimes open pdfs from my harddisk into Firefox.

I have never liked the IE or Opera because of the GUI and the lack of addons/extensions.

mattbiernat · #15 Post by **mattbiernat** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 4:46 pm

I switched from IE6 (when it had all those security issues) to firefox. Now these days IE seems to be more secure than Firefox. So I swtiched back again. Am I the only IE user in here?

#16 Post by **tomh009** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 5:04 pm

rkawakami wrote:Hey you too? I'm running a "pre-release" version of Adobe Acrobat Professional 6.0 on my system and I've attributed that reason to my FF lock-ups. Haven't yet tried installing the latest free Reader to see if that would cure it, but I like being able to print to a .PDF file from any application.

I'm running Acrobat 7, but since it's not the free reader, I have not yet upgraded to version 8.

#17 Post by **gator** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 7:02 pm

The only adobe reader I have on ALL my machines is version 5 (the fastest of adobe I have seen!). It serves my purpose adequately and does not take up a ton of memory like the newer versions do. If anyone wants it, it is availlable at http://www.oldversion.com/program.php?n=acrobat. By the way, f you remember to install this version make sure to turnoff auto-update and you'll be good to go

spuddog · #18 Post by **spuddog** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 7:41 pm

I have used Firefox (mozilla) for years. For those of you having trouble with Adobe Acrobat, Try Foxit. It is small and works well

Scoot

Purcy · #19 Post by **Purcy** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 7:52 pm

spuddog wrote:I have used Firefox (mozilla) for years. For those of you having trouble with Adobe Acrobat, Try Foxit. It is small and works well

Scoot

Yep, I use Foxit on my PDA also; great, tiny, fast.

#20 Post by **dorronto** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 9:19 pm

I use FireFox most of the time. IE7 for updates and now I'm starting to use Safari a little more. It has a pleasing interface and seems to load faster..............

Ron

brainpicker · #21 Post by **brainpicker** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 9:23 pm

mattbiernat wrote:I switched from IE6 (when it had all those security issues) to firefox. Now these days IE seems to be more secure than Firefox. So I swtiched back again. Am I the only IE user in here?

No! I use it too. I was an early adopter of Opera back when it was small enough to fit on a floppy disk. I may still have a v1.x around here somewhere. Then I accidently ran IE6 for a few hours and found it more stable than Opera so I switched. That was about 2 years ago. Yes, I missed some of the features, but Opera just seemed to get confused and would lock up my computer far too often.

I do remember downloading Firefox a few times thinking I'd try it, but I never did so count me as one of them!

I also use FoxIt instead of Acrobat as it loads faster and never gave me a problem.

- Yak

qviri · #22 Post by **qviri** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 9:36 pm

brainpicker wrote:I was an early adopter of Opera back when it was small enough to fit on a floppy disk. I may still have a v1.x around here somewhere.

Version 1.x of Opera wasn't public. Version 4.0 was the first Opera which installation file did not fit on a 1.44 MB floppy.

leoblob · #23 Post by **leoblob** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 9:44 pm

I use Firefox 99% of the time. IE primarily for Windows updates (as previously stated), and very rarely a page doesn't seem quite right in Firefox so I try IE for those.

Firefox does use a lot of memory, but I would think that people inclined to try Firefox would be users who do have lots of memory.

I personally find Adobe programs (Photoshop and Acrobat-regardless of version) to be the least stable programs I have. They don't lock up constantly, but I cannot remember the last time a non-Adobe program crashed or locked up.

#24 Post by **tomh009** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 10:13 pm

leoblob wrote:I use Firefox 99% of the time. IE primarily for Windows updates (as previously stated), and very rarely a page doesn't seem quite right in Firefox so I try IE for those.

SharePoint-based intranet sites really need IE, as does Project Server. But that's what IE Tab is for -- it can switch rendering engines automatically based on the URL.

mattbiernat · #25 Post by **mattbiernat** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 10:28 pm

brainpicker wrote:
mattbiernat wrote: No! I use it too. I was an early adopter of Opera back when it was small enough to fit on a floppy disk.

i was never able to get used to opera. for some reason it feels too flashy to me. I know you can skin it but its just not the same.

brainpicker · #26 Post by **brainpicker** » Sat Aug 18, 2007 10:35 pm

qviri wrote:
brainpicker wrote:I was an early adopter of Opera back when it was small enough to fit on a floppy disk. I may still have a v1.x around here somewhere.
Version 1.x of Opera wasn't public. Version 4.0 was the first Opera which installation file did not fit on a 1.44 MB floppy.

You are correct, but back in the day I had lots of friends asking me to try lots of software that wasn't "ready for prime time" as they say. I think they call it alpha testing today, but 10+ years ago with my friends it was more like "Hey Yak, I met this guy at the *** convention and he has the makings of this neat program and...". In fact I had a desktop set aside on which I'd try these programs (never on my other computers). Much of it never made it to the public, and almost none of those that did are still around, but when it did become public I'd get a free license for my efforts. Yipee! It was never enough compensation for all the times I had to re-install my OS, but it was fun trying things before others knew about them. I've thrown out hundreds of floppies containing such software though I may still have a few in the "room from hell". I don't do that testing anymore and haven't for about 7-8 years. Funny, I used to know how to use all the popular software and most things people never heard of, but today when I try something new it seems the learning curve is much steeper. Excel gives me fits! Maybe I'm just getting old and set in my ways?

- Yak

dsigma6 · #27 Post by **dsigma6** » Tue Aug 21, 2007 11:19 am

Too many people just don't know the difference.

Ray...You're keeping IE around just for Windows updates? Delete it!

http://windizupdate.com

#28 Post by **KristianJ** » Wed Aug 22, 2007 5:24 am

dsigma6 wrote:Too many people just don't know the difference.

Ray...You're keeping IE around just for Windows updates? Delete it!

http://windizupdate.com

I thought IE was uninstallable...in any case I tried Windiz this morning - seemed to work fine. Whether I use it further remains to be seen.

dsigma6 · #29 Post by **dsigma6** » Wed Aug 22, 2007 7:04 am

I've been using it for over a year, and have mentioned it on the forum many times. It's probably best that the user base remains small!

This Just In: 75% of people are idiots!

alfio · #30 Post by **alfio** » Wed Aug 22, 2007 8:12 am

gator wrote:The only adobe reader I have on ALL my machines is version 5 (the fastest of adobe I have seen!)

have you tried Foxit Reader? it's very fast, much faster than acrobat

alfio

75% of the people who download Firefox don't use it

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75% of the people who download Firefox don't use it

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