Did I make a mistake?

Message

mtnester · #1 Post by **mtnester** » Sat Sep 29, 2007 2:02 am

I'm posting my query here rather than the Z series forum because I would like to have the point of view of ThinkPad owners that may currently have another type of ThinkPad yet have knowledge or experience of the Z61t laptop.

Okay, I thought I did my homework before getting a Z61t off eBay. I couldn't find much in the way of reviews on it and what I did find had positive things to say. It wasn't until I Googled a different search term that I discovered this forum. (Better late than never?)

Reading the Z series forum makes me wonder if I did myself a disservice by buying the Z61t. The specs were attractive, but if I'm going to experience audio problems, this is not a good thing since I wear hearing aids and have difficulty with feedback using headphones. Problems with sleep mode, sudden death, screen flickers, wireless issues, the Z series being a "test" model for parts to be moved to the T61 or R61 series, etc. etc. Reading through the Z forum makes me wonder if I made a mistake; perhaps I should have waited till I could afford another T series laptop. (I love my T20 but it just doesn't have the memory, speed or capacity to handle my demands.)

Should I get rid of the Z? Is it glitchy or substandard compared to other ThinkPads? Is the Z61 by and large a great computer? What is your opinion?

Thanks for any help/input!

dr_st · #2 Post by **dr_st** » Sat Sep 29, 2007 9:59 am

I think you're over-apprehensive. Of course if you browse through a forum where people report problems and ask for help, you'll read mostly about problems. That doesn't mean that the Z-series in large is substandard, compared to other Thinkpads. I know of one very large corporation that's seriously considering using Z61t's instead of T60's for the laptops they are giving to their employees.

#3 Post by **ryengineer** » Sat Sep 29, 2007 9:31 pm

When I said test model, I specifically mentioned think of Z series as a test model. It was discontinued since lenovo felt there was no room for it if they could offer almost everything in T series.

I am a former user of Z series and never had any issues that most users come here and mention; apart from wireless once if I remember correctly.

Diehard · #4 Post by **Diehard** » Tue Oct 02, 2007 12:20 pm

It very much depends on how much money you had to pay. I bought an used Z61t. It's 8 months old, and still have more than 2 years 8x6 warranty for 620$(not include shipping cost).
My problems with z61t lied on Win Vista. After installing Win XP, everything works just fine.

mtnester · #5 Post by **mtnester** » Tue Oct 02, 2007 1:54 pm

dr_st wrote:Of course if you browse through a forum where people report problems and ask for help, you'll read mostly about problems. That doesn't mean that the Z-series in large is substandard, compared to other Thinkpads.

dr_st:
I did consider that, which was another reason I didn't want to post to the Z series forum but instead seek a more balanced point of view. (i.e., my spouse relates surgical horror stories as a result of working in Intensive Care, making you wonder if anyone gets through an operating room unscathed--a very one-sided point of view.)

ryengineer:
Thank you for the reminder. In my confusion (read "panic" or "paranoia") I totally missed the point of your original post.

Diehard:
The specs were better than most other TPs being offered and the "Buy It Now" with shipping was under $1K. I didn't even have an opportunity to set it up before leaving on a trip. That gives me something to look forward to when I return home. I still have to remember how to find the detailed system info on it to ensure that I got what I paid for. In the meantime my trusty T20 keeps me company for simple tasks (other than internet use--too sloooooooow). It should have a "full" warranty since it was advertised as "new, sealed in box."

I appreciate the participation of all those taking part in the poll. The population may not be statistically significant; nevertheless, the percentage is reassuring.

rek · #6 Post by **rek** » Tue Oct 02, 2007 10:19 pm

For what it's worth, given equivalent spec I would take a Z61t over a 14" T61

It's been a while since I last looked in the tabook.pdf, but I'm pretty sure the Z61t is made out of CFRP plastics like the T and X series, and it was only the 15.4" Z61m that was made out of cheaper feeling ABS.

The Z series came under the microscope a lot more from enthusiasts than the other ranges, as it's the first series to be 100% conceived after the Lenovo takeover. (Nevermind that it's still the same people doing everything)

sokos · #7 Post by **sokos** » Wed Oct 03, 2007 3:00 am

go for it, i got both myself a T61 and my father a Z61t.
Will you be suprised if i say that i prefer using the Z61t?

It has MUCH nicer design than the T61, it works great and it's battery lasts more since it has the onboard graphics intel950.

Speaking of which, i m suprised how well it works for an embedded graphics solution!

Only problem it has that the speakers aint loud (well they aint exactly loud at the T61 either) as Thinkpads and sound are two terms that don't walk together

mtnester · #8 Post by **mtnester** » Sat Oct 06, 2007 2:50 pm

sokos wrote:go for it, i got both myself a T61 and my father a Z61t.
Will you be suprised if i say that i prefer using the Z61t?

It has MUCH nicer design than the T61, it works great and it's battery lasts more since it has the onboard graphics intel950.

Speaking of which, i m suprised how well it works for an embedded graphics solution!

Only problem it has that the speakers aint loud (well they aint exactly loud at the T61 either) as Thinkpads and sound are two terms that don't walk together

Actually, I am surprised about your preference for the Z61, since the T series seems to be the one preferred by most of the magazine articles I've read over the years. I really do like my faithful T20, underpowered as it is, but it fights with me anytime I want to do anything more than word processing or a simple personal finance program.

With the positive comments I've read on the thread I've begun the process of getting the Z set up and have already gotten in over my head (i.e., screwed up somewhere--what in the world is tvt_gina.dll and how did it mess with Fast User Switching--not expecting an answer here, just a rhetorical question).

Thanks to all for your comments/input. I am feeling pretty good about my purchase.

ibear · #9 Post by **ibear** » Thu Oct 11, 2007 3:08 pm

not sure about the quality since i don't own one, but z61t sure looks nicer than t61.

jobooth321 · #10 Post by **jobooth321** » Fri Oct 12, 2007 9:01 pm

I have a Z60t and love it. It's reliable, very well built, and good looking (titanium lid). I've put 2GB of RAM in it and am hoping to upgrade to a 7200rpm drive soon. It rocks. Only thing I dislike is battery life. Oh well. That, I can deal with.

billp117 · #11 Post by **billp117** » Mon Oct 15, 2007 11:34 pm

I have three ThinkPads. All of them are OK. The Z61t is not my favorite. As it turns out I use my X30 the most. It is small, fast enough, and cost me a whopping $200.

The Z61t cost me about $1400 by the time I added 2 GB of Ram (for Vista back when it cost a fortune) plus I added the three year warranty and another battery and charger and a 7200 rpm HD. My negatives are the weight and the poor sound.

If I could ask for an ideal laptop...I would like my old T23 back. It worked fine, had great audio, and was replaced by the Z61t. Little did I know that I would give up on size, weight, and audio.

Since you already have the Z61t...looks like you are stuck with it. Lenovo builds good units...but they are not as rugged as the T23 or for that matter, my X21 that has a metal keyboard bezel. Now that is a sold unit...but a little slow. You can solve your audio problem by using a Motorola bluetooth headset.
Good luck, Bill

treydur · #12 Post by **treydur** » Sat Oct 20, 2007 12:22 pm

controversy on this series

i also got a pretty good deal on mine at the time of purchase. i had some issues but they were not related to quality or performance of machine.

last december I tried Vista on it, and at the time the driver situation was a nitemare, i finally got everything working, but i would not have recommended it for the faint of heart. now I see they have all drivers out and apparantly works with Vista, but ultimately I decided that Vista was just a hog and XP Pro served my purposes just fine. it's the 9440-D9U

the only compaints I have are that I do not care for the Intel Graphics as opposed to the Nvidia graphics, but I initially thought I would never want to play a high end game on this laptop, but I use it so much now and like it so much, I want to, but the GMA950 and down simply cannot play current generation of games. I dont necessarily think thats a slam on this computer, more on that graphics card. Here is the one slam that is fair. The speakers suck, no way around it, for the place this brand occupies, there is no excuse for them. I have 2 year old second hand Dell's (uhg) that have far superior speakers. I have even toyed with the idea of performing speakerectomy and trying that, but I am to chicken i will mess something else up.

i have use the R & T series and while they are nice, I do not see huge advantages less the graphics card/speakers to any of them. Mine has the titanium lid and literally still looks right now like it's new out of the box. i see my model going for under 1K now and am just amazed. there is not enough differances to justify the market value it's being assigned. This is one of the most durable and rugged 'feeling' laptops I have ever used.

it's a shame that IBM/Lenovo let this become the red headed step child of their Thinkpad series by deciding it was a duplicate of other models, but rest assured you have a fine, high quality Thinkpad

cj3209 · #13 Post by **cj3209** » Sat Oct 27, 2007 8:51 am

I use a Z61t for work and it has never failed me.

PROS:
- relatively light-weight;
- hi-res wide screen LCD;
- good keyboard;
- titanium LCD cover (always looks new);
- LCD lid is ROCK SOLID;
- LCD has accurate colors;
- built-in webcam;
- relatively fast (with 7200 RPM HD and 2 GB of RAM).

CONS:
- weak Thinklight (dull yellow color);
- weak speakers;
- some flex near the hard drive lid;
- the L and R-click mouse buttons for the trackpad are small;
- 4-cell battery is really weak and wears out quickly (around a year and it's now yellow (FAIR Condition));
- LCD could be brighter.

I would recommend it; it's a very good Thinkpad if you don't play the latest graphics-intensive games.

CJ

mtnester · #14 Post by **mtnester** » Wed Nov 07, 2007 12:14 am

I do appreciate the continuing comments on this subject since I have gotten some good insights/info from the input you all have been willing to share.

My Z61t doesn't have a webcam, but for under $1K I got everything else I considered really important--2GB RAM, bigger battery, 7200 RPM HD. Agree the LCD could be brighter. I do miss the dedicated graphics card of my T20, but decided I would make myself be satisfied with integrated graphics and stick to very simple on-the-fly photo editing tasks on it.

Another big plus was that it came with XP rather than Vista. So far I believe I may just skip Vista and wait for the next OS. Maybe by that time I'll have laid my trust HP LaserJet 5L to rest and won't have to worry about getting a driver for it.

treydur, I believe the controversy continues due to the several that had been offered on eBay recently and the general lack of info on them in the websites I normally check. I had no idea this site even existed until I searched for help on the Z, but I'm very glad to have found you all.

Bill, many thanks for the heads-up re: the Motorola headset. Will try to find one that does not use earbuds--no room in the ear for buds and aids too. If I don't use the aids I may as well just mute the speakers anyway.

zachsandberg · #15 Post by **zachsandberg** » Fri Nov 09, 2007 12:24 am

I have had my Z60t Model 2513 for a little over a year now, and have had no issues with it whatsoever. It has been rock solid stable, and a joy to work with. It even lived in Iraq for 4 months this year in the dust and sand, and still looks like new. The only thing I've done is added an additional 512mb of ram for a total of 1gb. Battery life is only mediocre though. I get a little over 2 hours, however I am using Linux, and also keep the display at 100%.

http://theprojectfiles.com/xhtml/laptop1.php

-Zach

mtnester · #16 Post by **mtnester** » Fri Nov 09, 2007 4:11 am

Zach,

I'm confused. Linux has an affect on battery usage? Somehow I can't wrap my head around that concept. (I was considering installing Linux on a separate partition so I could dabble it in a little but I'm having trouble as it is getting my TP correctly set up on XP Pro.)

qviri · #17 Post by **qviri** » Fri Nov 09, 2007 8:23 am

Cutting a long story short, Linux's power management is not as good as Windows'. You will definitely see a shorter battery life in Linux, and I say this as someone who boots Linux most of the time.

And just to clarify, this will only be when you're running Linux. Booting Windows gives you your usual power consumption and battery life.

gatgilbert · #18 Post by **gatgilbert** » Sat Nov 17, 2007 4:32 pm

I bought a Z61m from a certified IBM reseller on Ebay ($699 + ship). Condition new, 42 month warranty, 6 month Lenovo + 3 year extended. T2300 core duo, 120g hd, 2gb ram, dvd burner, Vista. Primary usage as a desktop replacement in my tv room. Connection high speed cable. Had trouble unpacking Vista, Lotus suite that came with it wouldn't install (XP version). Installed Open Office. Fingerprint reader wouldn't work, Dvd burner not recognized, hardware acceleration failed, and other things to numerous to mention. Initially thought it was a lemon. Installed Ubuntu Fiesty dual boot with Vista, upgraded to Gutsy everything worked (easy install, haven't tried wireless). Spent several days with Vista, back and forth between Viista upgrade and Lenovo driver downloads. Got rid of Symantic security and installed Macaffee suite provided free from Comcast. Installed Spybot. Finger print reader fixed by new software from Lenovo. The original setup for my model # was 2 - 512 mb of ram and a cd rw drive, and I think XP pro. I think the hardware was changed but the recovery section on the hard drive had old drivers. With all of the problems solved, I like the Z. It's Vista rating is now 3.1 (due to graphics) not blazing fast, but acceptable. It boots in a reasonable amount of time. Ubuntu is much faster than Vista, but lacks the ability to use Netflix live, and TV from network websites. This was my low cost replacement solution for my T22 with limited graphics, one dead ram slot and a dead battery. Its a big improvement. I like the larger screen. It's a little sturdier and has many more features than my old T.