Please read my experience on KEYBOARDs, please share yours

[visitor]

Hi everyone,
I admit this is a quite recurring topic but believe me I have browsed just about every occurrence since the pre-Lenovo days and it seems it will always remain as a near-myth issue: the different keyboards found in different versions of different Thinkpads. Not only is the keyboard different between models but there are differences within a same model (thus different versions). And I find it extremely regrettable that when you spend top cash for a laptop that is reknowned for keyboard quality you are just in the dark, crossing fingers about it. I must add that the keyboard issue gets even harder to address given the fact that different users have different preferences. And it doesn't much help to read user opinions that sound more like some kinf of self-reassurance than objective opinion (mine is "awesome", that kind of thing).
So here I am, looking at the horizon for a future upgrade and hoping that maybe some kind soul would generously provide enlightment regarding the keyboard difference with the newer models.
My first Thinkpad was a T23 which was such a great system at the time, but my expectations about its keyboard were frustrated, lots of flex, almost no tactile response, shame. But the machine was nice in all other respects.
Then I got an X31, early 1.3 model, and I was strikling surprised by how better it was to type on that little thing than on the bigger T23. I actually would preferred a more crisp and clicky sounding response (I use an old buckle-spring IBM external), but even silent the X31's was so comfortable not to mention that sometimes the lack of noise is a convenience.
But I missed the larger and brighter screen of the T23.
Then chance came for upgrade and I decided to settle on a T42 for everything that I had read in Thinkpad forums. I thought I would have the best of both worlds : a nearly perfect system with gorgeous screen and keyboard.
Funny things happen. I sold the T23 to a friend, with my soul comfortable of selling a good machine and not pushing something bad. The T23 still is a very good system. So while getting ready for the T42, I went on doing my stuff on the little X31. Then came the next trips, the wireless airport thing, and by the time I finally bought the T42 (with all specs that I wanted, splendid 1400x screen, ATI 9600 video, 1.7 centrino, 100 % solid keyboard, everything much better) it happened that I was already under the spell of the X31's lightness and smallness and long battery life for total wireless experience, reading eBooks on the couch, watching movies in bed, and carrying it around even inside a mere paper envelope, and opening behind tight train or airplane seats. Í kept both for a while, along with a 20.1 widescreen LCD monitor. I realized then that I would use one or the other not both so it made all sense selling one. Guess what, I sold the T42, more powerful, cooler, better screen, good video-out (unlike the T23's), man, did it hurt. At least it stayed in the family and my brother was the lucky one to get it. When I turned on a little program that adds typewriter sounds to the T42's solid but silent keys he felt like going back to his old IBM electric. It is that good.
Well I don't know whether my X31's keyboard and that T42's are Chicony, ALPs, NMB, Thai, whatever. Of course I would like to know and would love to have the choice to get the one that I'd find more pleasant.

Being kind of a power user (I do a lot of typing text, as well as video and audio editing) I'm beginning to see the need for more capacity, especially for music audio work since newer software gets more demanding. But this time, the Mac route seems almost a dead-end and I'm finding it very difficult to rule it out as I kept doing till now, simply because there are specific things that are only available or only work in certain Mac models.
Problem is a MacBook Pro isn't as small and light, and it's hot being such a powerful machine. Plus I've never typed on it, so I don't know what to expect, even though I have read generic comments saying it has a good keyboard.
I could maybe get a cheaper iMac and keep the X31 for the road and everything other than AV specifics. But then again there's that thing about in practice not using both. I also have no idea of the kind of keyboard in the iMac, and I suppose I couldn't possibly connect my old IBM in it.
So I'm in the crossroads: should I get an X6x and see if I can still get around the AV specifics by making clever use of it as happened so far or should I conform with getting a Mac ?
My questions about the X6x series is (you guessed it) the keyboard, if it will be much worse than the X31's to the point of regret, and also: the PC card expansion: will I have a true capable ExpressCard to allow me connect to eSATA and FW800 external drives ? (The X31 at least has cardbus, too bad the CPU is needy when intensive AV tasks are at work).

Thanks for reading this account, and feel welcome to point out suggestions or express disagreement. I hope it somehow helps other users that have similar dilemmas.
Best regards

[iamdmc]

1. The X6x series uses Cardbus. It pisses me off too - Expresscard would have saved space and is a lot faster

2. The X6x series keyboard is different than the X31 keyboard, but after you get used to it, you like it even more than the X31 keyboard. It's a bit more natural to type on, is quiet enough, is crisp, etc. I've used a number of thinkpads and dell laptops and this is the best keyboard out of any of them.

[watchtower7]

A little off topic but so you think the x series is enough real estate for video editing?
Will you be using an external monitor?
I just bought an x61s and am an Avid editor and even though I dont think it will run Avid due to the onboard video, I might just go to Adobe Premiere.
Stepping up (down?) from a Dell m70 workstation that was Avid approved to the x61s in favor of mobility.
___________________________________
Lenovo X61s 7669 Outlet (waiting for shipment)
L7300 / 80GB 5400RPM Hitachi(200 gb 7200RPM Hitachi 16mb cache in hand) / 2GB RAM / XP Pro/ Ultralight XGA / AGN Wifi / 8 Cell/ 2007 Office Small Business/ 3 Year Depot warranty

[visitor]

iamdmc:
Thanks for replying. What you wrote about the X61s keyboard is very encouraging. I must admit that when I liked the X31's keyboard it was a bit of surprise because it wasn't a perfect thing and it was not exactly what I was hoping for, it just surprised me that it felt good to type long texts on it, so I believe it could happen again with an X6x.

The ExpressCard is a confusing thing . I read somewhere that the slot in the X61 would accept either Cardbus or a thinner version of ExpressCards. I still have no confirmation about that.

watchtower7:
Thanks too. In my X31 which is just a 1.3 centrino with 1 gb RAM I edit TV programs in DV, often fix glitches in the originals with Vegas 6, and then author DVDs from them which the sponsors distribute to associates, and also convert video segments to mpeg-4 for their web sites.
I use an external Dell 20.1 flat panel which I had thought would be too much for the X31's ATI 16-bit card but, surprise, it's here fine happy at full 1600x1050 resolution.
I do not do simultaneous video tracks, only occasional transitions, and in fact slideshow videos (animated pictures with music, text and narration) seem the most intensive task I do. Of course converting DV to mpeg-2 takes 3 times real time (1 hour DV takes 3 hours in Canopus Procoder's mastering) so when it's time for that I just run a batch and take a break myself.
Well I have never done HD video but my hint is that an X6x won't have any problem with it.
My audio demands are much heavier than my video stuff because it's multitrack with lots of real-rime software plug-ins and these require CPU power. Up to certain level I can do fine with the X31 but for full orchestrations and lots of DSP I have to recur to rendering tracks to WAVs.
An important thing to have is an external 7200rpm hard-disk. I'd say two, for matter of backup since these things break unexpectedly. Currently I'm doing everything with a 250gb Seagate ina USB 2.0 case. All my SATA and Firewire stuff have broken, as well as my WD Raptor and my Hitachi 7200rpm. I had a SIIG FW800 cardbus card, never worked, tried with a Lacie D2 and an ADS case. That's the bad part with PC laptops and where the Macs have an advantage. So now I keep a 5400 cool drive inside, use a little RAM disk and throw all AV stuff in the USB disk. No complains, and I also use a 24-bit USB audio board. I suggest you maximize your X61 RAM because it gets very handy avoiding disk activity. I took the X31 on the road and recorded classical concerts in 24-bit relying on battery power. Only at the very end did I have to save it all to disk (and then no need for fast HD). But of course that's live audio. If you do any stuff on the road that requires say an external HD bear in mind that you will have to plug it somewhere because except for Macs, the firewire found in laptops doesn't provide power. An alternative is to use a 7200rpm 2.5 external and feed it by way of two USB slots. I have hope that all this mess will clean up when SSD prices come down to Earth.
Oops, guess I wrote too much (good IBM keyboards here ...).

[mrgetalife]

I read somewhere that the slot in the X61 would accept either Cardbus or a thinner version of ExpressCards

Here's the deal on that. With an adaptor. That's really a PCMCIA USB adaptor. It can support Expresscard USB based cards. So it'll support those cellphone wireless cards that are electrically usb based..

[mfbernstein]

I read somewhere that the slot in the X61 would accept either Cardbus or a thinner version of ExpressCards

Here's the deal on that. With an adaptor. That's really a PCMCIA USB adaptor. It can support Expresscard USB based cards. So it'll support those cellphone wireless cards that are electrically usb based..

First, that still excludes a lot of things like eSATA and FireWire 800 ExpressCards cards which use PCI-express, not USB.

Second, nobody (at least on this forum) has managed to get ahold of said adapter. Makes one wonder if they actually exist in the wild.

[visitor]

First, that still excludes a lot of things like eSATA and FireWire 800 ExpressCards cards which use PCI-express, not USB.

Actually, I do have a cardbus FireWire 800 card. Never got it to work though and support for it is very dim in the non-Mac world.
I've seen cardbus SATA cards around, but have read no experience account from users. Add to that the confusion which reigns with SATA terminology: SATA, SATA 2 , SATA 3000, eSATA, what else ? How they are (or not) compatible and what is the real-world advantage. For desktop usage I see the benefit of the SATA archtecture over IDE, but if you have a laptop and want to connect external drives there's no gain, except with the smaller but faster 10000rpm WD Raptor, and that is just because they decided not to build an IDE model.
USB 2.0 is OK for using a couple of externals or DVD writer or audio board and the current 7200rpm drives are perfectly good for non-industrial work. USB is a little faster but in reality a little slower than Firewire 400 and it taxes the CPU a little. OTOH though USB seems way more robust and reliable than Firewire, at least in the PC world. And remember if you connect something by way of USB or Firewire it won't matter if it's done through cardbus or ExpressCard becaus USB and FW are the bottleneck, not cardbus. If you want FW800, my advice is: hire someone to configure it and make it work for you, then check if all works and then pay the guy, otherwise, jump to a MacBook Pro, live with it and miss the coolness , lightness, long-battery and keyboard that you enjoyed with your X notebook.
From what I have read in specialized reports, I feel quite optimistic that soon I will no longer have to deal with FW800, eSATA, etc because real-world SSD drives are just around the corner. The small models already (32gb) available in the market seem plenty enough for intense multitrack audio which is my main concern. Video will have to wait a little longer because DV video files require more room and now there's HD video.