Need hard disk space for my T42 Thinkpad

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dilip · #1 Post by **dilip** » Wed Dec 05, 2007 5:57 pm

I have a 2373K5U (T42 2373) Thinkpad with its original 40GB drive. I am running out of space but do have a 2nd hard disk adapter with a second 40GB drive. What kind of drive should I purchase to increase my capacity?

I believe that I need a PATA (or ATA6) IDE drive, and believe that 120GB is the largest I can go with, as per a discussion I had with IBM support today. They recommended staying with 5400rpm. I did see the threads below. Here are a few questions:

* Ideally, I would like to make the new drive be my primary one, but I tried a year or so ago to make an 80GB drive work and followed online and IBM tech. support advise, but just couldn't get it to work. The hidden partition kept being an issue and I ended up with a non-bootable 2nd drive. Is there an easier way now to quickly clone so that my new drive can be my primary?

* It would be easier of course just to stick the new drive in the second drive bay; I do have an external USB DVD burner, so CD/DVDs would still be fine, at least when at home. Would there be any heat build-up issues?

* Are the drives less reliable as the density increases? Any recommendations of specific drives that work well and places to purchase them?

I did see the similar thread
http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=45184 . Thanks!

Dilip

#2 Post by **richk** » Wed Dec 05, 2007 6:41 pm

The biggest drive I know of that will work in your T42 is the western digital 250GB. It will work in the second drive bay or in the first. The procedure for making it the primary drive depends on whether you have a recovery partition or an HPA. The easiest way to tell is to look in control panel/administrative tools/disk management and see if you can see the recovery partition.

kosse · #3 Post by **kosse** » Wed Dec 05, 2007 6:51 pm

This thread should help with the HD cloning process. Never done it myself but after installing everything on a new HD for my T41 I wish I had.

dilip · #4 Post by **dilip** » Wed Dec 05, 2007 6:56 pm

Wow, 250GB sounds great; would such density make crashes more probable? I wonder why IBM support said that only 120 GB would be supported. Let me follow the thread in the following post and see if cloning will be easier this time around. Thanks!

#5 Post by **richk** » Wed Dec 05, 2007 7:05 pm

Make sure you get a PATA drive. The WD 250GB comes in PATA and SATA. Also, if you cannot get the recovery partition installed, you can always buy a set of recovery CDs.

#6 Post by **BillMorrow** » Wed Dec 05, 2007 7:14 pm

richk wrote:Make sure you get a PATA drive. The WD 250GB comes in PATA and SATA. Also, if you cannot get the recovery partition installed, you can always buy a set of recovery CDs.

BUY..?

make a set from the existing 40gig drive..
then run the recovery on the new drive..

also, while cloning is nice (and acronis has never fasiled ME) it brings the warts as well as the lipstick from the old drive to a new drive..

chan_man · #7 Post by **chan_man** » Wed Dec 05, 2007 9:41 pm

The easiest way that I have found is to purchase the 2nd HDD adapter kit from IBM / Lenovo. The kit contains the adapter that will allow you to have two harddrives in your laptop but it also comes with a floppy disk to clone the drives directly. All you have to do is to attach a USB floppy drive, place the diskette in, put the new hardrive into the adapter as a second drive and power the machine on. You will have to press enter 2x and the cloning process is started, for a 40gig drive, the process will run about 40 minutes.

dilip · #8 Post by **dilip** » Thu Dec 06, 2007 3:09 am

It's exciting to get such good information so quickly - I'm getting closer to getting my hard disk issue resolved! Thanks to all. Here are some followups to the information posted:

* It looks like I need to get a 2.5" PATA (or ATA6) IDE drive - and NOT a SATA drive. Nobody has said anything about higher capacity drives resulting in densities that more likely crash, so I assume that drive technology has come along. I am thinking that I should stick with 5400rpm so that both drives are the same speed? I did read someplace that WinXP Pro, which I'm running, needs some Microsoft patch for drives over like 130GB?

* richk mentioned Western Digital's 250GB. As he suggested, I ran AdminTools/DiskMgmt and my 40GB shows up with a 4.47 GB FAT32 IBM_SERVICE partition (plus a 32.79 GB NTFS one). From wdc.com, if I look under Mobile Drives, the highest capacity EIDE (i.e., not SATA) drive is the 250 GB 5400RPM 8MB cache Scorpio WD2500BEVE - is this the one?

* From seagate.com, I selected PATA and found the DiamondMax Plus 9 @ 250GB was the only choice.

* For Hitachi, when I searched by product families, I see that the 2.5" PATA drives with capacity at least 100GB are the Travelstar 7K100 (capacities 60-100GB @ 7200rpm), E7K100 (same), 5K160 (40-160GB @ 5400), 5K120 (60-120@5400), 5K100 (40-100@5400), E5K100 (40-100@5400), and several with speeds of 4200rpm; it looks like the 160 GB PATA HTS541616J9AT00 may be a good choice (5K160) and is available for around $110.

* If I do clone, I assume I'll have the recovery partition just in my original 40GB drive? I could make the recovery CD set and then reformat the 40GB original drive, after it has been successfully cloned, to get a single fully usable partition? Or is there any advantage to having the recovery partition left in the original and/or copied over to the new disk?

* chan_man recommended the 2nd HDD adapter kit. I do have the 2nd HDD adapter - but don't know if it's different from the kit. I have a sled that I have put a second 40GB hard disk into and was just planning on using it for a new drive -- but I don't have the cloning disk. I just called IBM support and they are sending me a new kit and asking me to return my old sled - so I should have the software by Monday! That was great service!! Now to find a USB floppy drive ... I assume that this will work, hidden partition and all.

Thanks for the great thoughts and input here!!

Dilip

P.S. I have 1GB in two original 512MB chips; would I see a performance improvement in replacing one of the chips with a 1GB one for 1.5GB memory, or is no real improvement seen till it's maxed out at 2GB? What would I do with the 512MB chips?

rhema83 · #9 Post by **rhema83** » Thu Dec 06, 2007 12:02 pm

If you are looking purely for capacity, then 5400rpm drives are cheaper dollar-per-GB. Hitachi drives are known for reliability, so the 5K160 is a good choice.

However, if performance is a factor, then the Hitachi 7K100 should definitely be considered. FYI, I have been running a 7K60 in my T42 since 2004, and it is still going strong.

Cloning is convenient but you tend to clone all the software errors from the old to the new. If you can afford the time and effort, a clean install will almost always improve software reliability and performance.

1GB of RAM is okay. If you want to upgrade, you might as well go all the way up to 2GB. I have that in my T42 and applications in Windows XP simply flies.

Just my 2 cents.

dilip · #10 Post by **dilip** » Thu Dec 06, 2007 12:15 pm

Thanks, rhema83, for your input. The Hitachi 5400rpm sounds like a good way to go. I tried to find it (HTS541616J9AT00, 160GB, pata) and found that ZipZoomFly has it for under $100 - but they list the interface as ATA7 - I need ATA6, no? Also, it's a "bare drive" - what screw in sled do I need to also find? Thanks.

#11 Post by **richk** » Thu Dec 06, 2007 1:49 pm

The drive will work fine. ATA-6 just means it will support any ATA drive at speeds up to ATA-6 spec. A bare drive is what you want. Just move the caddy from your old drive (held on by 4 screws).

dilip · #12 Post by **dilip** » Thu Dec 06, 2007 2:50 pm

Sounds good. But since it's more than 130GB, will I need to download a Microsoft XP patch to get it to work? I couldn't find definitive choices for larger 250GB Western Digital (5400RPM 8MB cache Scorpio WD2500BEVE ?) or Seagate (DiamondMax Plus 9 ?) drives or places to buy them.

awolfe63 · #13 Post by **awolfe63** » Fri Dec 07, 2007 4:27 pm

dilip wrote:Sounds good. But since it's more than 130GB, will I need to download a Microsoft XP patch to get it to work? I couldn't find definitive choices for larger 250GB Western Digital (5400RPM 8MB cache Scorpio WD2500BEVE ?) or Seagate (DiamondMax Plus 9 ?) drives or places to buy them.

No

dilip · #14 Post by **dilip** » Fri Dec 07, 2007 4:39 pm

Thanks! I'm off to order this 160GB drive - thanks to all. By the way, in my research, when I called Hitachi at 888-426-5214, they had a note that drives beyond 80GB aren't supported, but I assume that the collective wisdom here trumps that.

awolfe63 · #15 Post by **awolfe63** » Fri Dec 07, 2007 5:25 pm

That just means that at the time of launch - only drives up to 80GB were listed.

I have put 100GB drives in all of mine.

dilip · #16 Post by **dilip** » Fri Dec 07, 2007 5:48 pm

Thanks!

dilip · #17 Post by **dilip** » Sat Dec 08, 2007 4:26 pm

I ordered the Hitach 160GB disk and look forward to getting it. Thanks to all of you!

One followup .... as I had mentioned in an earlier post, IBM service seemed great and said they would send me a new 2nd Hard Disk Adapter, as it comes with a diskette that is a drive cloner. In fact, the online description of the adapter does indicate that the box includes the diskette.

However, the adapter arrived yesterday and had just the adapter and no documentation or diskette. When I called back, I was told to talk to sales, which will have to wait till they're open on Monday. Does anybody have any suggestions on where the disk can be obtained from? The service personnel didn't know of a link to a downloadable copy. Thanks!

#18 Post by **richk** » Sat Dec 08, 2007 4:51 pm

I have never heard of a drive cloning diskette, and I've cloned lots of drives, and have a few adapters, but if there is such a thing, I would love to get a copy or an image.

awolfe63 · #19 Post by **awolfe63** » Sat Dec 08, 2007 4:53 pm

When I bought one of my 7200RPM Hitachi drive upgrades at retail, it came with an external case for the old drive and cloning software.

dilip · #20 Post by **dilip** » Sat Dec 08, 2007 5:34 pm

Thanks, Andrew. I hope that the retail bare drive that I purchased from ZipZoomFly comes with the same items that you have received.

dilip · #21 Post by **dilip** » Sun Dec 09, 2007 11:31 am

Thanks, Andrew. I hope that the retail bare drive that I purchased from ZipZoomFly comes with the same items that you have received.

doppelfish · #22 Post by **doppelfish** » Mon Dec 10, 2007 4:36 am

rhema83 wrote:FYI, I have been running a 7K60 in my T42 since 2004, and it is still going strong.

The 7200rpm drives are said to be significantly noisier than the 5400rpm drives. What's Your opinion on this?

cheers,
-- fish

chan_man · #23 Post by **chan_man** » Mon Dec 10, 2007 10:50 am

richk wrote:I have never heard of a drive cloning diskette, and I've cloned lots of drives, and have a few adapters, but if there is such a thing, I would love to get a copy or an image.

I have purchased 3 of the second HDD adapters from IBM / Lenovo and they have all included a diskette in them for cloning drives. This diskette will provide for 10 licenses (or 10 drives that can be copied). I will have to check, but I think this software is from a 3rd party so not sure if an image of this can be legally made.

awolfe63 · #24 Post by **awolfe63** » Mon Dec 10, 2007 11:45 am

doppelfish wrote:
rhema83 wrote:FYI, I have been running a 7K60 in my T42 since 2004, and it is still going strong.
The 7200rpm drives are said to be significantly noisier than the 5400rpm drives. What's Your opinion on this?

cheers,
-- fish

It is noticeable - especially during seek. I find it less annoying than a loud fan - but it might bother some people.

dilip · #25 Post by **dilip** » Mon Dec 10, 2007 11:56 am

Thanks, chan_man. I just called IBM sales, as the service department had asked me to do, and they were confused as they originally thought this part was discontinued. I showed them how to search on it and they found it, but then they were not sure if software was included. When I pointed out the description, they finally just left it that a supervisor will be calling me back to try to find out if the software is available. Hopefully I'll be able to figure out how to get the software!

--Dilip

chan_man wrote:
richk wrote:I have never heard of a drive cloning diskette, and I've cloned lots of drives, and have a few adapters, but if there is such a thing, I would love to get a copy or an image.
I have purchased 3 of the second HDD adapters from IBM / Lenovo and they have all included a diskette in them for cloning drives. This diskette will provide for 10 licenses (or 10 drives that can be copied). I will have to check, but I think this software is from a 3rd party so not sure if an image of this can be legally made.

doppelfish · #26 Post by **doppelfish** » Tue Dec 11, 2007 8:34 am

awolfe63 wrote:
doppelfish wrote:The 7200rpm drives are said to be significantly noisier than the 5400rpm drives. What's Your opinion on this?
It is noticeable - especially during seek. I find it less annoying than a loud fan - but it might bother some people.

Thank You. I'll stick to the 5400rpm drives, then.

cheers,
-- fish

dilip · #27 Post by **dilip** » Mon Dec 24, 2007 12:15 am

I received a new 160 (actual capacity 148) GB Hitachi drive and was hoping to get the 2nd HDD adapter cloning software from IBM, but have been unsuccessful. As per my initial notes above, I know I can use something like Acronis (and Acronis True Image 11 Home is available through January for $10, after rebate) or Ghost. But I'm still confused as to whether that pesky hidden partition will be cloned over.

I'm thinking of keeping my existing 40GB drive as data and not touching the hidden partition. In any case, I already created recovery CDs. And some have advised against cloning as it may bring over any existing problems (possible spyware, utilities slowing down performance, etc.).

If I were simply to use the new drive as my new primary drive, what is the easiest way to either clone (without a hidden partition) or just get Win XP on it and then take my time installing my applications? Thanks!

Dilip

Need hard disk space for my T42 Thinkpad

Need hard disk space for my T42 Thinkpad

250GB would be great!

Thanks for the kind and detailed disk question responses

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