IBM Refuses to Send "Free" XP Downgrade Disks

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Ken Fox · #1 Post by **Ken Fox** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 6:59 pm

Like many, I've read posts on these forums indicating that if you buy a Thinkpad with Vista installed, a simple phone call to IBM Support (Lenovo's contract support in the USA) will result in receiving a "free" set of XP downgrade disks.

I have just taken delivery of two new T60s loaded with Vista Business; one is for myself and the other was purchased for a friend. They are identical 2008-URU models.

I called IBM support and spoke with two different people. The first person contacted a superior, and told me that the XP downgrade recovery disks cost $45 plus $3 shipping. When I stated that the policy had changed, and that these disks were now free, I was transferred to another supervisor, who repeated that the disks cost $45 plus shipping.

I gave up and said "thank you, goodbye."

If the Lenovo policy has changed on these XP recovery downgrade disks, it is certainly not being universally applied. I am posting this as a warning to those who may buy a Vista system and think that the issue is resolved, as has been posted before on these forums.

For myself it is not going to matter. I have XP recovery disks produced from another T60 (type 2007) system that I'm sure will work, which is only slightly different in components and shares the same chipset. For the average person, however, who expects to be able to get the downgrade disks easily, and for free, this could present problems.

Brad · #2 Post by **Brad** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 7:04 pm

Ken,

I experienced the same.

I have asked several representatives and all have told me the same as what they told you.

If someone there is offering free downgrade disks I haven't found them yet.

Brad

#3 Post by **RealBlackStuff** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 7:42 pm

The 'free downgrade to XP' may have originated from a number of people, that bought TPs with Vista recently, and found out that the set of recovery disks that were delivered with them, were actually XP disks.
Had a few of those on the Lenovo forum.

#4 Post by **ryengineer** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 7:55 pm

There was never a policy in place to send free Product recovery disks, the anecdotes you heard were result of generous reps sending them out for free or if you call IBM EasyServ (different than IBM Support Center) then perhaps you may get them for free also.

Including them with new machines was a different story.

#5 Post by **Harryc** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 7:57 pm

I was one of those that bought a T61P with Vista Business, but got XP recovery discs shipped with the machine. To me it was no big deal because I simply made a set of Vista recovery discs using R&R. I think RBS is correct in that nobody ever got BOTH a full set of Vista recovery discs AND a full set of XP downgrade discs shipped with a new machine.

Ken Fox · #6 Post by **Ken Fox** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 8:12 pm

The new machines just received did not come with any recovery disks, although the machines, of course, can make them (in the Vista version).

The friend I encouraged to buy a system (1 of the 2 received) was told, by me, that he could get a free set of XP recovery disks if he needed them, since I had read that this was the case, in posts on these thinkpads.com forums.

Since the Vista license allows downgrading, and since I already have a set of similar XP recovery disks, I'll just make a copy and give them to my friend.

But I think it is misleading to post that these disks are free for the asking, at least in N. America. I have read posts even from moderators/administrators here that imply that. For those without easy access to a set of those disks, as I have, this could be a real PITA.

#7 Post by **bill bolton** » Tue Jan 29, 2008 5:57 am

Ken Fox wrote:But I think it is misleading to post that these disks are free for the asking

Unless you can point to posts that specifically say that here, its misleading to make that sort of claim.

#8 Post by **JaneL** » Tue Jan 29, 2008 9:00 am

People post things here all the time. That doesn't mean all of them are correct, and that's just part of participating in a public forum. All you have to do to see that is look at the threads where people disagree.

As an volunteer admin, unless I see something that I know not to be true, I certainly don't read every post with the intention of researching it and make sure it's correct, but as a consumer, I don't believe everything I read either.

In this case, I'm sure some people probably did get them for free based on their circumstances, their gift of gab, the mood of the rep they talked to, and the alignment of the sun, the moon and the stars. However, here's what Lenovo has to say officially about acquiring the discs:

http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... STA-DWNGRD

Ken Fox · #9 Post by **Ken Fox** » Tue Jan 29, 2008 4:49 pm

I'm not trying to assign any "blame" on this issue, just trying to correct the record. I don't believe everything I read in these forums (or anywhere else), but I had seen this misinformation about the free downgrade disks repeated in a number of threads here, so many that it appeared to be a resolved issue.

Had I absolutely needed those downgrade disks, I would not have ordered these systems. I knew from the start that I had my own sets of XP product recovery disks, so it was not going to be much of a personal issue in any event.

As an aside, I haven't found anything in Vista yet that would appear to justify the aggravation of upgrading. Maybe something will show up in the next week or two, but if it doesn't, I'll be running XP on that system pretty quick. It's kind of funny in hindsight to go back to all the worrying about Moduslink and that "free Vista upgrade program" that generated so many threads last year. I wonder what percentage of the individuals who worried about this issue at that time have ended up even using Vista on a longterm basis?

Techgurl · #10 Post by **Techgurl** » Tue Jan 29, 2008 5:33 pm

I got the moduslink upgrade and never installed it. Decided to stick with XP Pro for now.

Ken Fox · #11 Post by **Ken Fox** » Tue Jan 29, 2008 6:15 pm

Techgurl wrote:I got the moduslink upgrade and never installed it. Decided to stick with XP Pro for now.

I've got 4 of them sitting in a drawer, and NONE of them was ever installed. When and if I sell the used systems, I'll include those disks as an incentive for the buyers who might think they were "missing something."

Brad · #12 Post by **Brad** » Fri Feb 01, 2008 8:35 am

I just received a set.

For a T61p FRU 44Y2956.

Is this the same FRU as yours Ken?

Brad

Ken Fox · #13 Post by **Ken Fox** » Sun Feb 03, 2008 11:27 pm

Brad wrote:I just received a set.

For a T61p FRU 44Y2956.

Is this the same FRU as yours Ken?

Brad

I'm not sure I understand your question, Brad. I searched the lenovo site for this FRU and could not come up with anything. Is it the FRU for a recovery disk set? My recovery disk set was generated by a T60, and of course has no FRU. I'd assume that the FRU for a T61 recovery disk set would differ from that for a T60, if for no other reason than the difference in chipsets.

Brad · #14 Post by **Brad** » Mon Feb 04, 2008 7:07 am

Ken,

I double checked the FRU and I mixed up a couple of the numbers. The T61 Windows XP FRU should be 44Y2596. Sorry about that.

I didn't realize that you had prepared the recovery set from the ThinkPad. I thought you meant that this set was provided with the ThinkPad when you received it.

Brad

cj3209 · #15 Post by **cj3209** » Mon Feb 04, 2008 12:45 pm

Ken Fox wrote: As an aside, I haven't found anything in Vista yet that would appear to justify the aggravation of upgrading.

Actually, after tweaking vista business, it runs smoother and faster than xp pro. Just turn off features like indexing, aero, and the side bar. Vista seems pretty stable to me so far and I'm running a bunch of adobe products on my T60p.

CJ

Ken Fox · #16 Post by **Ken Fox** » Mon Feb 04, 2008 7:10 pm

cj3209 wrote:
Ken Fox wrote: As an aside, I haven't found anything in Vista yet that would appear to justify the aggravation of upgrading.
Actually, after tweaking vista business, it runs smoother and faster than xp pro. Just turn off features like indexing, aero, and the side bar. Vista seems pretty stable to me so far and I'm running a bunch of adobe products on my T60p.

CJ

I still have Vista on this T60, but have XP on several other Thinkpads including T60s. I have not "tweaked" the vista install, but have a very simplified installation (from the recovery partition) in which I eliminated the junk such as everything Symantec, many Thinkvantage applications, etc., plus I've used MSCONFIG to greatly reduce what boots at startup.

As I see it, Vista is at least 10-15% slower than XP and offers little other than geewhiz graphic effects. If you turn off those Geewhiz graphics, indexing, and whatever, then I don't see much at all to recommend Vista, but then maybe I'm missing something. I have used XP since it came out and I've never regarded it as unstable, or in need of anything much (at this moment) as an OS.

Vista seems to provide a bunch of effects that no one asked for, and the new feature set (as far as I can determine) offers little to the consumer, just something to MS and other software mfrs. in the way of anti-piracy. All of this comes at a cost in hardware resources. It is as if you paid in time and money to protect the income stream of the software producers, which in fact is what you HAVE done.

#17 Post by **RealBlackStuff** » Mon Feb 04, 2008 9:47 pm

Why do you think so many people downgrade (back) to XP.
We are all too old for all that (eye)candy, it causes decay!

Puttagee · #18 Post by **Puttagee** » Mon Feb 04, 2008 11:18 pm

RealBlackStuff wrote:Why do you think so many people downgrade (back) to XP.
We are all too old for all that (eye)candy, it causes decay!

LOL.... I'm waiting for my T61 to arrive with Vista, and their is a very good possibility that I'll be downgrading to XP. Originally I was going to order this TP with XP but after I found out about downgrading I figure I'll at least take Vista for a test drive to see what it's all about. XP is by far the most stable Windows OS I've used and I just may end up using it after this test drive. Besides I can do without the decay.......

Robbyrobot · #19 Post by **Robbyrobot** » Tue Feb 05, 2008 3:56 am

Why do you think so many people downgrade (back) to XP.
We are all too old for all that (eye)candy, it causes decay!

So who has any teeth anymore?

dinglydoo · #20 Post by **dinglydoo** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 8:33 pm

I have a question about downgrading to XP from Vista. If I was to purchase Windows XP home full edition and do a complete fresh install on my Thinkpad T61 with Vista, what can I expect to lose and will everything work perfectly? I looked on Lenovo's site and found that they still offer drivers for T61's if you have XP.

#21 Post by **ryengineer** » Thu Feb 14, 2008 4:22 am

dinglydoo wrote:I have a question about downgrading to XP from Vista. If I was to purchase Windows XP home full edition and do a complete fresh install on my Thinkpad T61 with Vista, what can I expect to lose and will everything work perfectly? I looked on Lenovo's site and found that they still offer drivers for T61's if you have XP.

Except hidden partition and some third party softwares you can have everything on a clean install of Windows XP.

MeCasa · #22 Post by **MeCasa** » Thu Feb 21, 2008 1:59 pm

If you went with a fresh install wouldn't you lose all the Thinkvantage software (some good and some bad) ?

And are the recovery disks model specific? And if so to what degree?

I ask because I have a full set of XP(sent to me from Lenovo) for a T60 and would like to use this if I order an X with Vista.

Thanks

#23 Post by **ryengineer** » Fri Feb 22, 2008 2:20 pm

MeCasa wrote:If you went with a fresh install wouldn't you lose all the Thinkvantage software (some good and some bad) ?....snip

You'll, but you can reinstall them again via ThinkVantage System Update or (manually) through online driver matrices present on lenovo website.

MeCasa wrote:And are the recovery disks model specific? And if so to what degree? I ask because I have a full set of XP(sent to me from Lenovo) for a T60 and would like to use this if I order an X with Vista.....snip

Except a driver or two here and there, they work on many models and series, although legality is another topic.

MeCasa · #24 Post by **MeCasa** » Sun Feb 24, 2008 12:58 am

Apparently a topic we're not even allowed to joke about.

Oh well.................

Thanks for the reply

thekwijibo · #25 Post by **thekwijibo** » Sun Feb 24, 2008 5:45 pm

I'm currently trying to get a copy of a XP recovery disc for my T43. Since there isn't a way to purchase one from Lenovo, I was wondering if anyone is out there who has a copy of a recovery disc. This may be a touchy subject, but I'll say it anyways... I was hoping someone could make an .ISO image of their recovery disc and perhaps toss it on a FTP or something. I have a legit copy of XP running, but I need a copy of XP that will operate with my current key on my laptop when I try to swap my hard disc.
Can anyone help me out? Or if my request for an ISO is grossly offensive to some, I ask what "legit" options do I have? I want to keep using my current XP product key, but simply need the physical 0's and 1's to perform a reinstallation.

#26 Post by **bill bolton** » Sun Feb 24, 2008 7:40 pm

thekwijibo wrote:I'm currently trying to get a copy of a XP recovery disc for my T43. Since there isn't a way to purchase one from Lenovo

Who have you asked at Lenovo?

Cheers,

Bill B.

IBM Refuses to Send "Free" XP Downgrade Disks

IBM Refuses to Send "Free" XP Downgrade Disks

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