Which wireless to get!?

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off1c3r · #1 Post by **off1c3r** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 1:01 am

I am sooo confused now. I was reading through posts and posts of stuff.. now I don't know what to do. Ordered a T61 an hour ago (its 202am EST now) and I was going to call in the morning to modify it. Ordered the 100/7200rpm drive and I am changing it to the 160/7200 but for the wireless...

I had a t41, /w intel pro. It was that or thinkpad a/b. I got intel pro, and it was fine for me. Now i see there is an thinkpad a/b/g, the intel 3, and the intel 4965agn. I read people were having problems with the 4965 and it wasn't working, some say it works with the right drivers from intel, the thinkpad was great but draws more power.. the intels draw less... people are buying the Thinkpad N version after market to put in.. I have no clue what to get now =(

I am on the road a lot, Laptop is setup in my car, so I like to get wireless signals outside + in my house. I just want a clear suggestion as what to do. I don't care about opening it up an changing the card later on.. what do you think I should do?

Thanks!

#2 Post by **ZaZ** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 1:31 am

I honestly couldn't tell the difference the ThinkPad card on the X61s or the 3945 card on my R60. Both seemed about the same. Supposedly the ThinkPad card which is an Athernos card has a bit better range, but runs warmer. The ThinkPad card did seem warmer, but the X is a thinner machine so that may have played a part. If you plan on running Linux, Intel cards have much better Linux driver support.

Most likely if you call to modify your order, they'll make you cancel and place a new order which may or may not delay your order.

sjthinkpader · #3 Post by **sjthinkpader** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 1:34 am

I just upgraded to 11n and it is great. So I do suggest to get 11n in your new machine.

If you are on the road a lot and don't mind the extra $50 per month, get the WAN card too. I use the Sprint service and use a PCMCIA Cardbus card for that. We share it between two colleagues so a plug in card is better.

off1c3r · #4 Post by **off1c3r** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 2:15 am

FredGarvin wrote:I honestly couldn't tell the difference the ThinkPad card on the X61s or the 3945 card on my R60. Both seemed about the same. Supposedly the ThinkPad card which is an Athernos card has a bit better range, but runs warmer. The ThinkPad card did seem warmer, but the X is a thinner machine so that may have played a part. If you plan on running Linux, Intel cards have much better Linux driver support.

Most likely if you call to modify your order, they'll make you cancel and place a new order which may or may not delay your order.

Hmm, thats not bad then. I would love the extra range for sure.. but I don't want it to be a power hog or warm up the thing to much. I am going to be running xp prof, no linux so I guess that doesn't really matter to me. The X is thinner, but then again, I read that the thinkpads use more power so it may produce more heat? Thanks for info

sjthinkpader wrote:I just upgraded to 11n and it is great. So I do suggest to get 11n in your new machine.

If you are on the road a lot and don't mind the extra $50 per month, get the WAN card too. I use the Sprint service and use a PCMCIA Cardbus card for that. We share it between two colleagues so a plug in card is better.

11n? Is that the Thinkpad branded N version? What did you have before? I thought about using the sprint mobile card. Used the Tmobile one for a while.. wasn't that great and I ran out of money to support that cost per month along with my phone but I will think about in future once I get some more bills down

.. but for now.. still have to worry about the card.. You suggest me to get it, but just let me know if thats what you bought aftermarket cause online all I have is 3945 intel, 4965agn, and the thinkpad a/b/g

Thanks

#5 Post by **bill bolton** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 2:22 am

off1c3r wrote:people are buying the Thinkpad N version after market to put in

I did that for my T60 and it interfered with Bluetooth operation, so I went back to an Intel WiFi card.

I'm using the Intel 4965AGN in a X61 and a T61 under Vista without any problems at all and it's been great for me.

Cheers,

Bill B.

off1c3r · #6 Post by **off1c3r** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 2:47 am

bill bolton wrote:
off1c3r wrote:people are buying the Thinkpad N version after market to put in
I did that for my T60 and it interfered with Bluetooth operation, so I went back to an Intel WiFi card.

I'm using the Intel 4965AGN in a X61 and a T61 under Vista without any problems at all and it's been great for me.

Cheers,

Bill B.

Oh thats good to know, if it works fine on vista, then it should definantly work on xp haha =)

SHoTTa35 · #7 Post by **SHoTTa35** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 9:53 am

yeah i bought the Intel 4965AGN card also because i didn't want the power draw and heat of the Atheros and the 802.11N definitely helps RANGE so the Atheros "range" bit definitely gets knocked down some

I would get the Intel cards as i had the other and that one worked fine for me too. The older cards from before didn't work so well but i think these are more than enough.

sjthinkpader · #8 Post by **sjthinkpader** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 10:27 am

off1c3r wrote:...

11n? Is that the Thinkpad branded N version? What did you have before? I thought about using the sprint mobile card. Used the Tmobile one for a while.. ..... You suggest me to get it, but just let me know if thats what you bought aftermarket cause online all I have is 3945 intel, 4965agn, and the thinkpad a/b/g

Thanks

I bought an off brand and a Lenovo/Atheros. The off brand is working and the Lenovo/Atheros will be installed this week.

Of course you'll need an 11n router also. Mind is set as access point for ease of change. Had been changing access points (router) every year.

off1c3r · #9 Post by **off1c3r** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 1:36 pm

sounds cool. There should be a sticky for the types of wireless cards and their fucntions and stuff =)

icantux · #10 Post by **icantux** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 5:51 pm

FredGarvin wrote: If you plan on running Linux, Intel cards have much better Linux driver support.

This isn't entirely right. Atheros-based cards are more readily supported in Linux through madwifi and rarely an issue post-install, whereas Intel cards depend on ndiswrapper and native Intel drivers for full functionality, however, Intel is known not to play nice with the linux community as they refuse to release open source drivers that would greatly enhance reliability and functionality. Intel cards certainly do work, but require a lot more tweaking and often require additional installation of proprietary drivers (Intel win drivers) to fully work and support WPA/2 TKIP/AES encryption. Depends a lot on the Linux distribution as well.

#11 Post by **ZaZ** » Tue Mar 11, 2008 10:48 pm

In every distro I've used lately the Intel cards have worked out of the box while some Athernos and all Broadcomm cards I've seen have required extra steps to get them working. I'd agree a lot will depend on the distro.

tylerwylie · #12 Post by **tylerwylie** » Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:39 am

I'd have to say sometimes madwifi won't work the way it needs to is not enabled by default in most distributions so the average user trying to get it working on Linux might now know what to do. Intel drivers for the win!

off1c3r · #13 Post by **off1c3r** » Wed Mar 12, 2008 1:46 am

Haha.. I decided to leave the AGN in then, and just upgrade my HD from 100gb 7200rpm to 160gb 7200rpm .. I asked them to get me the IBM old school logo to put on my laptop, He said he made the request for the sticker to be included in my order haha... I just hope they don't give me some old stock laptop with the old logo just for the logo and I don't get the new style chasis with their 'updates'

Radioguy · #14 Post by **Radioguy** » Thu Mar 13, 2008 10:16 am

SHoTTa35 wrote:yeah i bought the Intel 4965AGN card also because i didn't want the power draw and heat of the Atheros and the 802.11N definitely helps RANGE so the Atheros "range" bit definitely gets knocked down some

But wouldn't the Atheros N card still beat that?

SHoTTa35 · #15 Post by **SHoTTa35** » Thu Mar 13, 2008 11:06 am

Radioguy wrote:
SHoTTa35 wrote:yeah i bought the Intel 4965AGN card also because i didn't want the power draw and heat of the Atheros and the 802.11N definitely helps RANGE so the Atheros "range" bit definitely gets knocked down some
But wouldn't the Atheros N card still beat that?

Hmm.. maybe? But what sprawling houses do you guys live in that you need that

The White House maybe? Can i come stay for the weekend? My girl is in town and i'm sure she'd like to stay there for the summer or something...

Anyways, i get 4-5bars on both levels of the house in the furthest corners so i'm guessing the Atheros might be better but i'm still getting 130Mbps anyways so good enough for me

sjthinkpader · #16 Post by **sjthinkpader** » Thu Mar 13, 2008 12:49 pm

After I changed to N Draft 2.0 (Airlink101 300N) from G-MIMO; the immediate noticeable improvement beside speed is the VPN connection. I used to have to try a few times before connection and now it can connect on the first try. So this must be a great reduction in the amount of errors and retries.

Both my old and new Router/Access Points register about the same amount of signal strength.

Since my 3Mb aDSL line is the bottleneck, I tried loading thumbnails from my large photo directories on a NAS. Now the wireless link is just about as fast as 100Mb hardwired ethernet.

We have a pre-N Belkin router at work with the Airgo chipset inside for about two years. This unit is the king of signal strength. Too bad that after the Qualcomm acquisition, they have no new design wins in Draft 2.0 generation.

Radioguy · #17 Post by **Radioguy** » Fri Mar 14, 2008 2:06 am

I find it amusing that people automatically assume that a laptop wireless card would only be used at home with their own router.
It's a laptop. It's gonna go where the coffee is warm, and the baristas are hot!

#18 Post by **bill bolton** » Fri Mar 14, 2008 3:26 am

Radioguy wrote:But wouldn't the Atheros N card still beat that?

My consistent experience out in the field with connecting to a very wide range of commercial grade access points, using T4x and T6x Thinkpads, is that the Intel based WiFi cards will hold up useful connections across the board, much better than Atheros based cards.

Clearly, there are range of very different experiences with WiFi useful connectivity.

Cheers,

Bill B.

sjthinkpader · #19 Post by **sjthinkpader** » Fri Mar 14, 2008 9:59 am

Bill,

I just counted the number of profiles in my AC to be 41. Probably 30+ of these are wireless and mostly collected from airports and hotel rooms from my old T41 with an Atheros card and in the past year a T60 with an intel card. I cannot say I noticed any difference.

Radioguy · #20 Post by **Radioguy** » Fri Mar 14, 2008 4:00 pm

bill bolton wrote:
Radioguy wrote:But wouldn't the Atheros N card still beat that?
My consistent experience out in the field with connecting to a very wide range of commercial grade access points, using T4x and T6x Thinkpads, is that the Intel based WiFi cards will hold up useful connections across the board, much better than Atheros based cards.

Clearly, there are range of very different experiences with WiFi useful connectivity.

Cheers,

Bill B.

Absolutely. I've had the exact opposite experience with Intel cards on every occasion where an AP wasn't in the same room as the card/adapter. I now take it on faith that this would be true with 802.11n, but I would love to see a side-by-side comparison to know for certain.

Radioguy · #21 Post by **Radioguy** » Fri Mar 14, 2008 4:02 pm

-double post-

Padhead · #22 Post by **Padhead** » Fri Mar 14, 2008 4:11 pm

the atheros (thinkpad) cards are better and more stable. They use about ten minutes more power on the average battery.

Radioguy · #23 Post by **Radioguy** » Fri Mar 14, 2008 4:13 pm

With both being N versions?

sjthinkpader · #24 Post by **sjthinkpader** » Fri Mar 14, 2008 6:28 pm

This post was sent over my newly installed Atheros a/b/g/n card. The AP is only a pre-N Airgo/Belkin. The card removed was an intel a/b/g card.

This is a T60 machine without the rollcage LCD structure. The 3rd antenna was installed in the left edge as the other two original antennae were at the top and right side. The BT card and antenna was at the bottom edge. I will try my 11n AP at home tonight.

sjthinkpader · #25 Post by **sjthinkpader** » Sat Mar 15, 2008 3:20 am

Deleted my old profile in AC for the 11n AP at home and made a new one for the new a/b/g/n card. Only got 54Mb. What the....?

Read .txt file for the Atheros a/b/g/n driver. It said to use AC ver 4.40. So I download ver 4.42 and installed it. Still 54Mb.

Read the Hints and Tips files. It said that only AES encyption can get 300Mb. My old WEP will default to 54Mb. Set the AP to use WPA AES. Now I got 300Mb connection.

http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... MIGR-67113

But my DSL line is only 3Mb.

I could load my large picture directories from a NAS pretty fast though. But that box is only 100Mb. So I need to upgrade everything to gigabit ethernet?

So the conclusion is 300Mb 11n is probably before its time.

sjthinkpader · #26 Post by **sjthinkpader** » Thu Mar 20, 2008 6:53 pm

Here is a report on how that Atheros 11n (FRU#42T0825) worked in my T60.

It connected to my Airlink101 300N router at home and reported 300Mb link.

At work, we have a Belkin/Airgo Pre-N router. When I switched between wired and wireless using AC, it refused to disable the radio.

I then tried using Fn-F5 to turn off the radio, no go either.

I then tried Windows Network Connections utility, no go either.

So I finally turned it off by the hardware radio kill switch. then I could switch to wired ethernet.

I talked to the vendor and they claimed AC need to be updated to work properly. But since this card had been out a year already, they issued RMA.

So after I try the replacement, I will report again whether this is a software issue.

Which wireless to get!?

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