[questions] WWAN vs. UWB?

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joh · #1 Post by **joh** » Sat Mar 15, 2008 10:57 pm

I am trying to buy x300 and if I select one with mobile broadband, I can't choose UWB option. does this mean uwb option is automatically coming with it or I can't choose it at all?

Also, will gps work outside of the usa?
I found out on this forum that i had to choose mobile broadband option to have gps, but i do not know if it works on the foreign land. it would be tight if it does.

Also, can i add wimax and uwb later manually?

Also, does anyone having defect problem with x300?
I remember i had to call lenovo several times for my x41t because of defects of machine, and i wonder how is the built quality of x300. I am trying to save some money by not buying warranty.

thank you so much~!!!

#2 Post by **shfawaz** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 7:36 am

For some reason when ordering from Lenovo Direct, you can't choose the UWB optioin when ordering the Mobile Broadband WWAN option, although I know you can buy an X300 with both options. The 6478-1JU X300 is one of two models that Lenovo offers that features both options, so its not physically impossible.

I have no idea if GPS works outside the US, but imagine that if a GPS device purchased in the US sometimes comes with maps for Europe so one can use the device there, then I would imagine that the GPS in the Thinkpad would work outside the US.

#3 Post by **erik** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 9:45 am

GPS goes along with the CDMA2000 card from verizon. it's not a separate feature that you can use by itself. you have to subscribe to a verizon wireless account to use it. whether or not it works outside of the USA is again dependent on the carrier you're using overseas and your stateside carrier's international roaming agreement. verizon would be the ones to call on that one.

UWB is on a separate antenna and the card uses its own socket. it can be added at any time to any X300 which doesn't already have it.

adding WiMAX later will involve adding a card or changing your current WWAN card if it doesn't already support WiMAX.

regarding warranty, i don't understand why you would be interested in a $2600+ thinkpad without an extended warranty. if you want to save money then you can always add warranty later before your 1-year warranty term is up. going without a warranty after that, in my opinion, is not a wise idea.

joh · #4 Post by **joh** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 11:00 am

thanks for the reply.

several more questions, if I may.

correct me if i'm wrong, but I thought gps works even if you don't subscribe to the verizon.

Also, is there any other places i can buy except lenovo direct?
(besides ebay)

and about the wimax.
Are you saying there is a seperate slot for the wimax or
i have to change the entire wwan card?

i didn't know i could extend the warranty (i know dell u could buy warranty)
thanks for the info.
but yeah about the warranty,
i hav warranty on my thinkpads, but they don't really help much.
i hav onsite protection for x41t, and everytime i tried to call them and they came to fix (minor stuff), but they end up breaking something else.
i had to call lenovo for 4 times for that.
if iknow how to take care about laptop, i thought i won't be needing warranty, especially when there is no moving parts, unless accidents happen, all i need to change in 3 years is going to be pan, keyboard, and palmrest.
if something is wrong with my motherboard or lcd, it will probably happen in one year.
anyway, i'm gonna buy 2 year depot warranty just in case like u said.

again, thanks for your time and knowledge

#5 Post by **erik** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 11:47 am

joh wrote:correct me if i'm wrong, but I thought gps works even if you don't subscribe to the verizon.

this is a good article on the X300 + GPS. it confirms that the function is provided by the EV-DO (CDMA2000) modem. you might be able to find software that can use the GPS functionality of the EV-DO card without needing to connect to the internet but i'm not sure if any exist right now. from what i understand, GPS is only going to be useful with a verizon subscription.

minehan · #6 Post by **minehan** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 12:59 pm

erik wrote:GPS goes along with the CDMA2000 card from verizon. it's not a separate feature that you can use by itself. you have to subscribe to a verizon wireless account to use it.

I have a 6478-1JU and have used the GPS without subscribing to the Verizon service.

k3davis · #7 Post by **k3davis** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 1:31 pm

minehan wrote:I have a 6478-1JU and have used the GPS without subscribing to the Verizon service.

Can you elaborate on this? Does your machine have the Verizon card present but your service isn't activated, or are you able to use the GPS without the verizon card installed at all? Can you describe what kind of functionality it has?

beq · #8 Post by **beq** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 1:46 pm

According to the IBM/Lenovo website (see here):

GPS is available only with Verizon WWAN systems. The GPS is satellite based, not carrier assisted. You do not need to activate the WWAN card.

Which seems to imply that the AT&T WWAN card for the X300 won't have GPS?

I'm also confused about the WiMAX. Will it only be available as part of the Centrino 2 "Montevina" platform refresh that Intel is releasing in June (specifically the Echo Peak Wi-Fi + WiMAX integrated chipset)? If that's the case it should be a general purpose unlocked WiMAX methinks.

Or will the WiMAX come in the form of a new Sprint XOHM WWAN card (perhaps an EV-DO/WiMAX combo) that replaces the Verizon/AT&T WWAN card? If that's the case I guess the WiMAX will be locked to Sprint (and maybe ClearWire) only?

In any case, are the WiMAX antennas already embedded in all shipping X300's?

minehan · #9 Post by **minehan** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 2:00 pm

k3davis wrote: Can you elaborate on this? Does your machine have the Verizon card present but your service isn't activated, or are you able to use the GPS without the verizon card installed at all? Can you describe what kind of functionality it has?

The Verizon card is installed but has not been activated. I have been able to use the GPS with StreetAtlas 2008 but I have not tried to navigate with it or do any other extensive testing. It did locate my position accurately on the StrertAtlas map. I merely wanted to see if it worked

#10 Post by **erik** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 2:07 pm

minehan wrote:The Verizon card is installed but has not been activated. I have been able to use the GPS with StreetAtlas 2008 but I have not tried to navigate with it or do any other extensive testing. It did locate my position accurately on the StrertAtlas map. I merely wanted to see if it worked

disconnect yourself from internet access and see if it still works. i'd be interested to hear what happens. while GPS might work by itself, i doubt it will be of much use without internet access.

if it does prove to work by itself and without realtime internet access then i'll add the EV-DO card to mine just for this function.

minehan · #11 Post by **minehan** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 2:26 pm

I disconnented the X300 from the internet and started the GPS appplication. It locked on the satellites but I was unable to launch Street Atlas directly from the GPS application without an internet connection. However, when I opened StreetAtlas the GPS signal was there and it was able to locate me.

craigg · #12 Post by **craigg** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 3:29 pm

While GPS is on the WAN card you don't have to subscribe to Verizon's service to use it. You will have to load an application onto your computer that includes all the maps for your area. There are quite a few stand alone applications on the market, many which offer turn by turn driving directions.

craigg · #13 Post by **craigg** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 3:38 pm

I have had quite a few issues in the past with poor builds especially with the Z series; however with this unit I must say that it performs flawlessly. No issues, no bad pixels, no bad drivers, no conflicts. I even upgraded to Vista Ultimate and the only driver I needed to reinstall was for the WIMAX. If Lenovo could put a Sony LCD in this it would be perfect. It's not that this LCD is bad, but the contrast is not great, and is nothing compared to what one might find in a Sony FZ or SZ series laptop. I'm sure a lot has to do with controlling power consumption.

joh wrote: Also, does anyone having defect problem with x300?
I remember i had to call lenovo several times for my x41t because of defects of machine, and i wonder how is the built quality of x300. I am trying to save some money by not buying warranty.

thank you so much~!!!

RaysMD · #14 Post by **RaysMD** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 4:30 pm

I wonder if anyone will try to transplant a Sony SZ series LCD to the X300.

Weez · #15 Post by **Weez** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 6:10 pm

erik wrote: regarding warranty, i don't understand why you would be interested in a $2600+ thinkpad without an extended warranty. if you want to save money then you can always add warranty later before your 1-year warranty term is up. going without a warranty after that, in my opinion, is not a wise idea.

Can you elaborate on this? I ask because i ordered an x300 from lenovo and added the 2 year extended warranty and accidental damage but can now buy the exact unit i ordered online thru a 3rd party. It's in stock and the only thing stopping me is the lack of the extended/accidental warranty. If i can add this directly from lenovo i would do it in a second.

craigg · #16 Post by **craigg** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 6:33 pm

You can buy it through Lenovo direct at full list or through a reseller at a discount. PM me for a quote if you need it.

#17 Post by **erik** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 7:23 pm

Weez wrote:Can you elaborate on this? I ask because i ordered an x300 from lenovo and added the 2 year extended warranty and accidental damage but can now buy the exact unit i ordered online thru a 3rd party. It's in stock and the only thing stopping me is the lack of the extended/accidental warranty. If i can add this directly from lenovo i would do it in a second.

you can add warranty at any time before expiration but protection services have to be added within the first week or so.

call lenovo warranty at 800-439-9320 for ordering info.

joh · #18 Post by **joh** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 7:33 pm

thanks guys.

so for the warranty, (which I here mean 'protection') we have to buy it in the beginning. Because protection (which lenovo fixes even if the owner made a mistake) is what we need (especially after one year).

Thanks for clearifying!

i guess no one have answered yet about WiMax. If you guys find out anything, please let us know.
for what I understand now from your feedbacks, I guess you need to replace the current wwan in order to have wimax function later.
Am i understanding this right?

Also, since my english is not so good, I am having trouble understanding the posts. I need a simple answer for the GPS.

is GPS working without internet being connected??

if not, like erik, i found no reason for getting WWAN myself.

Also, if one could tell us how long it takes to locate the current position and get directions using actual gps software (not google earth nor google maps) without internet being connected, it would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!!

minehan · #19 Post by **minehan** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 8:31 pm

joh wrote:

is GPS working without internet being connected??

If so, if one could tell us how long it takes to locate the current position and get directions using actual gps software (not google earth nor google maps) without internet being connected, it would be greatly appreciated.

On my 6478-1JU GPS works without being connected to the internet.

The time to acquire a satellite lock depends on the X300's view of the sky and the position of the satellites, but, in my brief experience, the time to acquire a usable postion is no longer than the time it takes for my Garmin Nuvi to find a position from a cold start.

#20 Post by **erik** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 9:04 pm

if GPS is actually usable without a subscription then i'll consider canceling my CTO order and getting a 6478-1JU. it has all the features i ordered on my X300 but adds the EV-DO card.

joh · #21 Post by **joh** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 10:03 pm

erik, by reading some of the articles, it looks like gps works without internet (even in the airplain)

just one quick question:

how can we buy specific models of the x300?

i ordered mine thru lenovo website, but i guess other people order differently.

i live in usa.

also, if i order prespecified x300, will it arrive faster?

thanks.

#22 Post by **erik** » Sun Mar 16, 2008 11:08 pm

topseller models are listed on this page. you can order them directly by calling 866-96-THINK.

beq · #23 Post by **beq** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 12:32 am

craigg wrote:I even upgraded to Vista Ultimate and the only driver I needed to reinstall was for the WIMAX.

Wait, so your X300 (a 6478-1JU?) already has WiMAX preinstalled??

I heard in another thread that WiMAX won't be available until months later.

That's why I was wondering if the X300 must first be refreshed with the Intel Montevina platform in which the WiMAX is integrated into the motherboard chipset (which we would be able to use simultaneously along with a Verizon or AT&T WWAN card). Or if Lenovo will release a Sprint XOHM WiMAX card that replaces the Verizon or AT&T WWAN card...

Maybe I need to re-read some of the X300 reviews again about the WiMAX status.

Edit: Regardless, I guess by this summer when Montevina is released, WiMAX will start to become a ubiquitous feature in new laptops from all manufacturers.

joh · #24 Post by **joh** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 12:33 am

thanks.

but this does not include any sales (including cpp) going on right now, so what's the benefit of ordering on the phone?

do they ship faster?

#25 Post by **erik** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 2:08 am

you'll need to call to answer both of your questions. i don't know what discount level you qualify for and i don't know what's in stock and how soon it can ship. i don't work for lenovo.

joh · #26 Post by **joh** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 2:55 am

thank you so much!!!!

seems like u are staying late night too!

#27 Post by **ryengineer** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 6:23 am

Some info. from lenovo on WiMax, beq, you'll find it useful:

lenovo wrote:What is WiMAX?

WiMAX is a new wireless broadband technology that will offer broad coverage for computer laptops and other electronic devices.
WiMAX will be appearing in select Lenovo ThinkPad's starting with the X300 (May 2008).

Some of the major backers of this Wireless technology are:

-Intel
-Sprint
-Clearwire
-Lenovo

How Does WiMAX Work?

WiMAX can be thought as a combination of the advantages of Wi-Fi and cellular. It takes the best parts of each of them - Wi-Fi’s speed and cellular’s coverage. It allows you to get broadband Internet access anywhere within your service provider’s coverage area.

The WiMAX network includes two key components:

-A base station, similar in concept to a cell-phone tower, set up by the service provider broadcasts the wireless signal to a very large area.
-A subscriber device, that could be a WiMAX enabled notebook, mobile Internet device, or even a WiMAX modem, receives the signal.

WiMAX would operate similar to Wi-Fi but at higher speeds, over wider coverage and for a greater number of users.

-In a Wi-Fi network, computers with Wi-Fi network cards connect wirelessly to a wireless router (Access Point).
-The range of Wi-Fi is basically at home or individual building due to the limitation of its coverage.
-If you change the location, you may need to reconnect to a different Access Point.

Unlike Wi-Fi, WiMAX's range is typically measured in miles rather than feet. The main distinction of the difference between the two standards means that Wi-Fi is focused on a local area network (LAN) technology which can provide wireless connection to a home, a coffee shop or one floor of an office building, and that WiMAX is a Wide Area Network (WAN) technology which can provide wireless connections for a small city.

And antenna configuration: Thinkpad X300.

There are in total 6 wires for the following communications capabilities:

-WWAN
-WiMAX
-WLAN or WiFi
-UWB
-Bluetooth
-GPS

beq · #28 Post by **beq** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 12:04 pm

Great info, and thanks for the diagram ryengineer!

craigg · #29 Post by **craigg** » Mon Mar 17, 2008 1:16 pm

Sorry for the confusion, but the only driver I needed to manually install was the Wireless USB (TPWUSB) upon upgrading to Vista Ultimate.

[questions] WWAN vs. UWB?

[questions] WWAN vs. UWB?

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