My X300 experience & screen disappointment

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blade12 · #31 Post by **blade12** » Wed May 07, 2008 3:25 am

I agree with duffy's comments. I was about 2 clicks away from buying one of these online, when the better part of my sanity told me to go and have a hands on demo first.

Lucky I did. Although it is a very responsive machine in terms of program loading times and bootup, the screen was a major let-down. I spent the better part of an hour trying to convince myself that it wasn't that bad, when the Sony SZ display sitting next to it brought me to my senses. OK, so it had a glossy screen, but next to it, the x300 looked a dull grainy blurry mess.

Another small annoyance was the space bar key which felt hollow and was rather noisy.

I left the store empty handed and heavy hearted. I'll stick with my t43 for now.

h.vu · #32 Post by **h.vu** » Wed May 07, 2008 6:33 am

Russ-ST24 wrote:I have to agree, I have X61s, X60 Tablet, T61, Macbook and the screens on all of these are far better for colour.
The X300 seems washed out like the contrast is too high, but lowering the brightness does not help.
Shame as I keep jumping back to my macbook as I get frustrated with it.

Russ

Yes, the screen of X300 is suck, the MBA or Sony SZ is better

#33 Post by **aamsel** » Wed May 07, 2008 7:40 pm

gator wrote:
duffy wrote: Im typing this on my T60, and I would glady give Lenovo a few bucks to upgrade my X300 display to match the quality of this 14" SXGA+. That's saying a lot.
That is quite a statement. I have seen so many complaints about the 14" T60 panels and when I saw one I thought they weren't so bad (remember, I am IPS fan). But to hear that the one on X300 is worse than the T60 panel is bad ... From what I read online, I thought they were similar. Are you positive about this?

Lenovo sourced the LCD panels for the 14.1" T60 SXGA+ from 2 suppliers: Samsung and Boe Hydis. The Hydis panels are quite a bit better. My T60 has a Hydis panel, quite good white and black levels, no backlight bleed, and text looks very good. It is dim in comparison to today's widescreens, and has poor viewing angles.

Andrew

jflamm · #34 Post by **jflamm** » Thu May 08, 2008 3:22 am

aamsel wrote: Lenovo sourced the LCD panels for the 14.1" T60 SXGA+ from 2 suppliers: Samsung and Boe Hydis. The Hydis panels are quite a bit better. My T60 has a Hydis panel, quite good white and black levels, no backlight bleed, and text looks very good. It is dim in comparison to today's widescreens, and has poor viewing angles.

Andrew

X300 displays are also sourced from two vendors: Samsung and TMD with the latter apparently being the better display. I have the TMD - and I have commented already and agree that the displays on any Sony and Apple are better. However my display is not grainy as some have commented and the text is fairly sharp. Curious if anyone has the Samsung panel ...

#35 Post by **aamsel** » Thu May 08, 2008 10:36 am

jflamm wrote:
aamsel wrote: Lenovo sourced the LCD panels for the 14.1" T60 SXGA+ from 2 suppliers: Samsung and Boe Hydis. The Hydis panels are quite a bit better. My T60 has a Hydis panel, quite good white and black levels, no backlight bleed, and text looks very good. It is dim in comparison to today's widescreens, and has poor viewing angles.

Andrew
X300 displays are also sourced from two vendors: Samsung and TMD with the latter apparently being the better display. I have the TMD - and I have commented already and agree that the displays on any Sony and Apple are better. However my display is not grainy as some have commented and the text is fairly sharp. Curious if anyone has the Samsung panel ...

Yes, I was aware of the two vendors for the X300.
I was simply adding that this was the same for the T60, since somebody brought up its quality.

It would be rare for any big notebook manufacturer to single-source any important part of a notebook.

Andrew

royhuang · #36 Post by **royhuang** » Fri May 09, 2008 2:27 am

Would you please tell me how can determine my X300's LCD manufacturer? The box says that my model was built on 17-Apr-08. Thanks.

Thecla · #37 Post by **Thecla** » Fri May 09, 2008 1:18 pm

royhuang wrote:Would you please tell me how can determine my X300's LCD manufacturer? The box says that my model was built on 17-Apr-08. Thanks.

You can go here to look up the parts numbers for your system

http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... yle=lenovo

42T0475 is apparently the TMD display (not sure what the Samsung LCD part number is).

ddignam · #38 Post by **ddignam** » Fri May 09, 2008 2:47 pm

For What It's Worth

I apparently have the TMD screen and am very happy with it. It's easily as good as the T60p (14") that I have and the T42p (15") that I used to have.

I don't use it for anything fancy, just coding, and definately prefer matte screens over glossy.

Build qulity of the X300 feels better than either of the older machines, the T60p was Lenovo, and the T42p was IBM.

royhuang · #39 Post by **royhuang** » Fri May 09, 2008 8:21 pm

Thank you Thecla for pointing me to the site. I have the TMD display on my X300!

Even though I was at first weary of the graininess of the matte display, I do prefer it over my Sony TZ because of 3 reasons: 1) no glare, 2) less visible smudges and 3) less visible light bleed from the LED backlights (looks like X300 has them on top and bottom whereas the TZ has only one at the bottom)...which is why battery life isn't as good as the TZ. FYI--I own a MacBook Pro, Dell XPS series, Flipstart, etc. all the way back to the Sharp Widenote (first LCD widescreen notebook released in the mid 90s) for comparison as well and have no complaints w/ the X300's screen.

Also, I don't know what the fuss is over the LCD panel. Weren't the ThinkPad series meant for mobile _business_ people? As one, I appreciate the brightness of the screen without glare while sitting at a waiting area near large airport windows, my loft floor-to-ceiling windowed wall Manhattan apartment and sitting out in Central Park...Otherwise, people should have bought a more 'consumer' or 'entertainment' centered laptop which X300 isn't.

#40 Post by **archer6** » Wed May 14, 2008 6:42 pm

While I've not seen an X300 yet, I have seen a few MacBook Airs, and yes the display is very nice. And I will qualify my comments by first saying that although I'm a died in the wool ThinkPad guy, I also like Macs as a second choice to a ThinkPad.

That said the issue I have with the new Macs is their lack of overall reliability as opposed to a few years back. I speak from experience as I just returned a brand new MacBook Pro because it kept dropping the wifi connection. It was the third and final one in a row over a period of three weeks. I finally gave up. Each of them had a serious flaw that rendered the computer useless, as a mission critical machine. Totally unacceptable.

I'm a laptop addict....and like trying others while always keeping a ThinkPad (actually several, see my signature) as my main machines.

Just another example of why I have remained a ThinkPad loyalist for over a decade.

Cheers.

#41 Post by **archer6** » Wed May 14, 2008 7:42 pm

Thecla wrote:Just to add a word in the opposite direction: I like the X300 screen a lot and am very happy with mine. YMMV

That's great to hear. Plus you have a USER replaceable battery....

Far better than the iPod like MacBook Air which has a captive battery, and 130 degree temps belching out of the keyboard to keep ones fingers from hanging around......

jflamm · #42 Post by **jflamm** » Thu May 15, 2008 4:43 am

I traded my MacBook Air for a TP X300 and an extrememely happy with the X300. The MBA forums are chock full with Apple fanatics - it would be nice if this one was more objective.

Despite the fact I like the X300 better - it is certainly true that the MBA has a far better screen. I have an X300 with two batteries and have not removed them yet (except when my machine played dead (twice) and I had to remove both batteries to bring it back to life). For someone who is going to buy another battery carry it around - fine - but otherwise it is a non-issue. MBA does have heating/fan issues but the keyboard doesn't get hot. If you look elsewhere in this forum, some seem to be having X300 fan issues. My TP drops connections in a certain cafe I go to and I believe it is a combination of the WIFI card, Windows XP and the access point they are using. I surmise this because I had a similar problem with Toshiba R500 with an Intel card. Lastly - plugging in USB devices occasionally crashes the machine. I am still waiting for the BIOS update they retracted.

X300 is a great machine and for me - one of the best I have owned. It's not perfect though.

Truthfinder · #43 Post by **Truthfinder** » Thu May 15, 2008 9:22 pm

Would would anyone spend upwards of $3K for a unit with a crapy display..? I understand it's the new toy on the block and is very thin and light, but give me a break.......

As long as there are people buying units from Lenovo with garbage displays, they will continue to build and see junk like this.

If Apple and Sony can buy high quality LCDs, why cant Lenovo. Simply put, because people still buy them even with the bad display.

With the state of our economy and the large supply of notebook computers, Lenovo had better wake up or they may find that people will move over to other vendors.

Save you bucks until Lenovo takes us, the buyers serious. Complaining after the fact will not get Lenovo to spend the extra couple of bucks for a quality panel.....

My 2 cents..............

#44 Post by **archer6** » Thu May 15, 2008 10:58 pm

I ask myself this question, how many people on this forum that are coming out so strong against the X300 actually own one, and use it? Of that group how many have had more than two or three ThinkPads so as to have a basis for comparison? Granted the X300 display is not as bright as the MacBook Air, however a good computer is comprised of far more than just the display.

How many on this forum have actually owned and used a MacBook Air? The glossy flat top slippery keys on the keyboard are quite different and I personally find them very challenging to type on at anything other than a very slow deliberate pace. Couple that with a sealed battery and other questionable decisions on Apples part and you have one very stylish fashion statement. And believe me I know how important that is to many people who are all about being "seen" .

Very telling indeed.

Finally my disclosure:
I have been a Mac Laptop enthusiast for over a decade, have owner 10+ PowerBooks, 1 Black MacBook, & 3 MacBook Pros, right up to the current model with the Penryn processor.

So.... I am certainly not bashing Apple, however I believe in fair reporting of my personal experience as opposed to hearsay or opinions.

After a decade of experience both with Apples and ThinkPads, I find the best consistency, performance, durability and overall track record of ThinkPads the best.

Cheers!

#45 Post by **gator** » Thu May 15, 2008 11:37 pm

Nice to see you back archer6!

Troels · #46 Post by **Troels** » Fri May 16, 2008 12:45 pm

Roisin wrote:suggest, the LED backlit isnt the holy grail

Exactly. In fact it seems as if Samsung in particular are producing less than stellar CCFL based LCDs as of the recent years.
Who knows why? Maybe in order to make LED based LCDs look better in comparisons, and then blame it on the fact that CCFLs are ancient, environmentally unsafe, battery consuming, and thus not as great.
Of course LEDs have merit, but with the current quality, they're far from what was promised.

For everyone not satisfied with the X300, return it or complain all you want. If you still want a Thinkpad of the latest range, IMO opt for an X200, throw the stock LCD away, and get yourself a Boe Hydis HV121WX5 AFFS LCD
See: http://www.beck-oled-lcd-tft-display.de ... X5-100.pdf

Either that, or i hope Lenovo is working with BOE-Hydis (or PVI-Hydis, who knows) on some AFFS solution for their upcoming models.

Thruthfinder is correct i think. What LCD manuf. list on their webpages are the best possible configurations only. Notebook manufacturers can have any custom modifications done they want. But it seems as if Lenovo doesn't want LCDs to be very expensive, so the odds of seeing a good quality LCD in a thinkpad again are, in my opinion not very good. But i hope im wrong.

The X300 still looks very nice i admit, if it wasn't for the screen on some models at least

#47 Post by **archer6** » Fri May 16, 2008 3:21 pm

gator wrote:Nice to see you back archer6!

Thanks gator!

It's great to be back on the best ThinkPads forum in the World!

Cheers!

Truthfinder · #48 Post by **Truthfinder** » Fri May 16, 2008 10:15 pm

If Lenovo continues to produce and sell sub-par units, we, the consumers should take a step back and look real hard before spending our hard earned $s. If Lenovo is made to eat these units, one of two things will take place.
1. They will open their ears and change the way in which they build these very expensive units. After all, we are not talking about a $399.00 HP unit purchased from one of the local junk stores.

2. They will have to eat these units or reduce the price like the junk sold at area electronic stores.

My point is, don't just buy something just because it has a new model number and is marketed with a bunch of hype......
Make Lenovo earn you business. Things are tight right now in our country and you can take it to the bank that these units which are manufactured in China cost cents on the $. Don't throw away your hard earned bucks.

In conclution, the specs on the X-300 are not up to par. Come on, the processor is as slow as a snail...... The display sucks and the battery life stinks. $3K..... I think not !

Lenovo, shame on you

My 2 cents.

#49 Post by **erik** » Fri May 16, 2008 10:27 pm

Truthfinder wrote:In conclution, the specs on the X-300 are not up to par. Come on, the processor is as slow as a snail...... The display sucks and the battery life stinks. $3K..... I think not !

Lenovo, shame on you

My 2 cents.

i'm curious... have you actually used an X300 or are you judging it by what you've read online? be honest.

adobe CS3 design premium on my X300 seems almost as fast as it did on my 2.4GHz-T7700-equipped T61p so i'd hardly call the processor slow as a snail. the display lacks contrast but isn't half as bad as some have it out to be -- in fact, i'd rank it higher than the 14.1" SXGA+ display that tons of people are perfectly happy using (my girlfriend included). and, battery life hardly stinks considering i get 5 solid hours of normal use with the 3-cell standard + 3-cell bay battery under server 2008 EE x86 of all things. i think i got my money's worth.

Truthfinder · #50 Post by **Truthfinder** » Fri May 16, 2008 10:40 pm

Yes, I a, reporting on ALL the negative info I've read herein.

No, I have not used a x300, but in my judgement, after reading one negative story after the next, I would have concerns before ploping down three grand for a notebook which will be selling for $1500 in a few months. But, this is not the point. IBM / Lenovo from what I understand should be a cut above the rest, not just OK, or fair, or well the display is ok, but not great. It should be great, not just ok.

I rufuse to buy anything but the very best for my $. I'm retired and don't have money to spend on a new unit everytime there is a model number change.

My 2 cents again............

Thecla · #51 Post by **Thecla** » Fri May 16, 2008 10:50 pm

Truthfinder wrote:If Lenovo continues to produce and sell sub-par units

Honestly, "subpar" is the very last word I'd associate with the X300. It's the sturdiest, best constructed laptop I've ever used, and it's a pleasure to carry around such a portable and versatile machine. No doubt some units have problems, and even in units that don't there are things that aren't perfect, but in my opinion the X300 is a lot more substance than hype.

It's true that the X300 very expensive, and not everyone is insane enough to be willing to spend $3K on a computer, but a considerable part of the price is the SSD, and the overall price is not inflated considering what goes into it. Lenovo gets a couple of big thumbs up from me on the X300.

#52 Post by **erik** » Fri May 16, 2008 10:53 pm

Truthfinder wrote:No, I have not used a x300...

in that case, shame on you for judging it based on anecdote rather than hard evidence.

i find the X300 to be the overall-best thinkpad i've ever owned going all the way back to the 701c in 1995. you name it and i've probably owned or used it. sure, the X300 isn't perfect but it's miles away from mediocrity as you so claim.

keep in mind that almost everything you read on forums will be negative. that's just the nature of forums and this one's no different.

Truthfinder · #53 Post by **Truthfinder** » Fri May 16, 2008 10:57 pm

To all concerned:

I wish everyone the best of luck with the new X300. I was only refering to all the complaints that I was reading.

I have been a ThinkPad user for a very long time and have mostly had great luck with my units. Currently, I own a T-60 and so far it's been a fantastic unit and the Lenovo service has been great.

I'm sure the X-300 will also be a great unit as well.

Best to one and all

Truthfinder · #54 Post by **Truthfinder** » Fri May 16, 2008 11:01 pm

I don't understand why so many people are reporting a poor display and poor battery life. I guess they are just making up negative stories. I guess I will have to find out about the new ThinkPads at another site.

#55 Post by **erik** » Fri May 16, 2008 11:27 pm

Truthfinder wrote:I don't understand why so many people are reporting a poor display and poor battery life. I guess they are just making up negative stories.

no one ever said that negative experiences didn't exist or weren't possible with the X300. however, you have to take the bad with the good and it seems like your judgments are based solely on the bad reports and not the good ones.

#56 Post by **archer6** » Sat May 17, 2008 10:51 am

Truthfinder wrote:No, I have not used a x300...

Thank you for your honesty

erik wrote: i find the X300 to be the overall-best thinkpad i've ever owned going all the way back to the 701c in 1995. you name it and i've probably owned or used it. sure, the X300 isn't perfect but it's miles away from mediocrity as you so claim.

I feel exactly the same way, even though I have not had my X300 for very long, thus far it’s an exemplary example of the kind of ThinkPad laptop that I have grown to admire and count on since the advent of the 600. I go way back with laptops, and they are mission critical for me as I use them of for high tech design, engineering, and the type of work that one could not do with a “consumer” laptop. It’s the tool I count on. In my professional world it’s about progress, change, development, and results. Fashion, fads, or appearance of our tools (laptops) is the last thing on our minds.

erik wrote: keep in mind that almost everything you read on forums will be negative. that's just the nature of forums and this one's no different.

Thank you for pointing out what is all to often overlooked. There are far too many negative people who seem to have nothing better to do than practice their skills as naysayers and act as though they know better than the very design and development engineers that have spent years acquiring the skills to create such performance, reliability and functionality that we enjoy in the ThinkPad lineup.

Cheers!

Goran · #57 Post by **Goran** » Sat May 17, 2008 11:49 am

Truthfinder wrote:
I rufuse to buy anything but the very best for my $. I'm retired and don't have money to spend on a new unit everytime there is a model number change.

My 2 cents again............

OK. What is the very best?

Conmee · #58 Post by **Conmee** » Sun May 18, 2008 12:54 am

Folks,

I have been ThinkPad-free for about 2 1/2 months with a Sony SZ and it's the best non-IPS screen I've ever used. No dead pixels, bright whites, great contrast, only wish the resolution was a bit higher (1280x800) and possibly not widescreen, although as a diehard 4:3 screen adherent, I'm getting used to the 13.3" WS form-factor.

Anyhow, I was ready to jump back to the ThinkPad camp with the X300 - the color-coded TrackPoint buttons tug at the heartstrings a bit, lol, (and I REALLY REALLY miss TrackPoint and keyboard feel), but this thread gives me pause. Can anyone take a side-by-side set of pictures between MacBook/Sony and X300? I can tell you that side-by-side with my T60p (Flexview) and X60 (work machine) that it's literally night and day in terms of brightness, color saturation, bright whites, etc. The Sony simply outperforms in every way (thought Flexview still wins out on sharpness/detail). I find if I have to skimp on a particular feature, a good screen is something I'm less likely to compromise on.

Anyhow, I have high hopes for the new ThinkPads coming down the line this year, and if they can get quality screens in the ThinkPads, especially Flexview (even if it's widescreen), I'll jump back in a heartbeat. As an ex-IBMer, and lifelong ThinkPad owner, I've felt a bit guilty the past few months... but on the flipside, my Sony looks and performs great so far (Vista being Vista...) lol

Daniel.

duffy · #59 Post by **duffy** » Sun May 18, 2008 8:19 am

Conmee wrote: Can anyone take a side-by-side set of pictures between MacBook/Sony and X300? ....... I find if I have to skimp on a particular feature, a good screen is something I'm less likely to compromise on.

The MBA and Sony SZ (TZ is even better) have some of the best TN displays available. I went from a MBA to a X300 and the immediate difference is readily apparent. The MBA display is so good that it makes the X300 display look abismal. Now that I have used the X300 for a few weeks I've adjusted to it and it looks perfectly fine. The X300 display isn't bad especially if you compare it to what is currently available in the Thinkpad line. With that said Lenovo probably has one of the worst line ups of displays available from any mainstream manufacturer.

If you must have a display as good as the SZ or MBA then you'll need to keep your current machine or look elsewhere. The X300 is the sum of many different parts, and if you look at the overall picture it is a compelling device. The increase in screen resolution is worth the price of admission IMHO.

If you live near a Microcenter you can do a direct comparison between the two. Then you can make your decision.

lophiomys · #60 Post by **lophiomys** » Sun May 18, 2008 8:48 am

just my two cents:
I could put my hands on a X300 for about halve an hour
and compare it directly to an X61s and my good old trusty
T42p UXGA Flexview.
IMHO the LCD of the X300 is better than that of the X61s
but still not as good as the UXGA Flexview. This just refers
to subjective perceived display quality, not size.

As the X300 is a great step forward, and feels stable and sturdy
in your hands, IMO it's the price tag of 3000,- Euros(!)
in relation to the not-premium-enough LCD screen,
what stops me from ordering one right away.

(Besides, I never get tired to mention that I would prefer
the classic 4:3 form factor and a classic keyboard without a
Windows Key.)

My X300 experience & screen disappointment

No Screen Disappointment here

LCD Quality

Lenovo Quality, is NOT job one

Re: Lenovo Quality, is NOT job one

Happy for you !

Re: Lenovo Quality, is NOT job one

I wish you the best with your new unit.

X300

Re: X300

Re: Happy for you !

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