Another "Which Thinkpad should I get" thread

[GnatGoSplat]

I currently have a babied T43 w/14.1" SXGA+ display. I've got the bug to get something new (to me) and different. My T43 is great, but I have 3 primary motivators to switch to something else: I want to try a widescreen laptop, I want something inexpensive to upgrade (T43 has that annoying SATA to IDE bridge requiring pricier IDE drives and also that extra beep and pause if using a non-IBM drive), and the value of used T43's is plummeting so I feel like it's time to sell it before I have to give it away.

• Primary usage: Couch surfing, and occasionally using it for data logging in my car or connecting to a portable digital oscilloscope.
• Need PCMCIA slot for my SCSI card (my o-scope requires it).
• Prefer widescreen, no bigger than 14.1" (my wife has a 15.4" and it is a MONSTER, way too big, way too heavy).
• Must have NON-shiny screen.
• Smaller and lighter, the better. Definitely no bigger or heavier than my T43.
• As fast as what I have would be good enough.
• Prefer cheaper upgrades: DDR2, SATA.
• Needs built-in Wifi (or ability to add built-in Wifi).
• Would like to keep it ~$500, or preferably less.

Unrealistically, I would love to get an X200 or X300, but I'm not willing to pay that much for a machine that's going to be used primarily for couch surfing. My T43 is a bit bulkier than I'd prefer, but if my new laptop feels no heavier or bulkier, that's fine. Searching eBay at completed auctions, it looks like potential candidates would be: used T61, Z61t, Z60t, or I could get a brand new SL400. For a 14.1" screen, I prefer the 1440x900 resolution of the T61 so I am leaning towards that one.

I also am not necessarily Thinkpad loyal so much as I am trackpoint loyal. I'd consider other brands of laptops so long as they have a trackpoint.

Thoughts?

[tylerwylie]

Z61t looks like what you're looking for, if you can up your budget 100-200$ you can probably find a T61.

[GnatGoSplat]

Yeah, I think you're right. I read that a Z61t with the smallest battery and no titanium in the lid is lighter than the T61. The T61 has better onboard video and newer chipset, but I really couldn't care less about that stuff. I like that the Z61t is slightly smaller, lighter, and it kind of looks better aesthetically.

I'm pretty sold on the Z61t, now I only need to find one. They've been <$500 on eBay and somebody had one on sale here 2-weeks ago for $375 shipped. I guess I should have started my search 2-weeks ago.

I did see Lenovo has some closeout T61's brand new for $577. I'm sure they're not WXGA+, but I might be okay with that. I still think I'll prefer to wait for a deal on a Z61t WXGA+ though.

[dr_st]

I'd take a Z61t over a T61 any day.

[ajkula66]

dr_st wrote:

I'd take a Z61t over a T61 any day.

+ 1 here...

[GnatGoSplat]

Thanks for all the advice. I just won one here. $426 shipped for a pretty basic one, no titanium, no camera, no fingerprint reader, no WWAN. I didn't need those things anyway. Kind of pricey for an older laptop, but a fair price compared to other completed Z61t's. I had hoped to use an eBay/PayPal 10% off coupon, but didn't realize until too late the seller doesn't use eBay checkout, d'oh!

Product: ThinkPad Z61t 9440-A23 [change]
Operating system: All [change]

Original description: Based on 9443-XDU: T5500(1.66GHz), 2GB RAM, 120GB 5400rpm HD, 14.1in 1440x900 LCD, Intel 950, CDRW/DVDRW, Intel 802.11abg wireless, Modem, 1Gb Ethernet, Secure chip, 4c Li-Ion, WinVista Home Premium 32

[ajkula66]

Well, you did get the better LCD and a C2D CPU so I really wouldn't be complaining...not a bad deal whatsoever. And it's quite upgradeable if you decide to go nutty...

Congrats!

[GnatGoSplat]

I got my Z61t today and am not really all that happy.
One is minor and my fault... I didn't realize at one point Lenovo changed the charging port, I can't use my existing Thinkpad charger. I can buy a new one for $9-10 shipped so it's no big deal.

The other is a scratch on the LCD. It's a tiny scratch, maybe 12mm long about 3" from the right of the LCD and about in the middle vertically. It's very, very fine. Maybe halfway between a cat hair and a spider web. I asked my wife to find it, she couldn't see it. Then I pointed it out to her, and then she said after I pointed it out, she couldn't NOT see it. I'm the same way, it's barely visible, but since I know it's there, my eye keeps getting drawn to it. She did say if it were her, she'd keep it, but she says I'm the type of person where it will always bother me.

Granted, it's a used laptop so cosmetic defects are to be expected, but it was advertised as no visible screen defects. If you were me, would you try to return it and find another, or am I being silly? I mean, it is so small I'm not surprised the seller didn't see it. My wife tells me any other used laptop I buy will probably have a scratch on the screen too, but I have bought no less than 8 used Thinkpads over the years (maybe more) and this is the first one with a scratch on the LCD.

[dr_st]

I got my Z61t today and am not really all that happy.
One is minor and my fault... I didn't realize at one point Lenovo changed the charging port, I can't use my existing Thinkpad charger. I can buy a new one for $9-10 shipped so it's no big deal.

Minor indeed, and has been the case for every Thinkpad since the Z60. The good thing is that this charger you will get for the Z61t will support any current Thinkpad, and hopefully many future ones.

I asked my wife to find it, she couldn't see it. Then I pointed it out to her, and then she said after I pointed it out, she couldn't NOT see it. I'm the same way, it's barely visible, but since I know it's there, my eye keeps getting drawn to it. She did say if it were her, she'd keep it, but she says I'm the type of person where it will always bother me.

If you were me, would you try to return it and find another, or am I being silly? I mean, it is so small I'm not surprised the seller didn't see it. My wife tells me any other used laptop I buy will probably have a scratch on the screen too, but I have bought no less than 8 used Thinkpads over the years (maybe more) and this is the first one with a scratch on the LCD.

I agree that if your wife didn't see it, even after you pointed it out to her, it's possible that the seller did not see it either.

As to whether to return it, keep in mind that Z61ts are not that easy to come by. They were never produced in such quantities as T series and not many of them appear on the second-hand market, much less when we're talking about a C2D model (there were just a handful of Z61ts with C2D), and the WXGA+ screen, this is a kickass machine, and if indeed other than the scracth it has no problems, there isn't a doubt in my mind that I would keep it (and I know myself to be sometimes very picky about small things).

You can always replace the LCD, if you want, probably will cost you $100-$150 to find one like that, we're not talking about uber-expensive IPS LCDs here. Or you can just live with the defect, as it does seem small.

I know there is no way to convince yourself that it is not there, but you can try to change your attitude towards it. Instead of being annoyed at the imperfection, consider it a mark of honor, like a battle scar, of your laptop.

[sparta.rising]

Having recently purchased a used Z61t myself, I can say its a very nice machine. I bought it locally, but I was comparison shopping on ebay (this was around a month ago?) and your price seems pretty good. There were a couple sold in the high-300's but they had WXGA screens.

As for the tiny scratch, I wouldn't worry about it, once you stop obsessing over it, you won't notice it. When you first flip it open you'll see it, but after 10 minutes of use your eyes will become accustomed to the screen and it won't be an issue.

The only downsides I've seen with the Z61t so far are availability of replacement parts and heat (mine is a 2.0GHz model and its a hot bugger). And contrary to all of the haters out there, I like the widescreen AR because it allows me to have two full pages/screens open side-by-side.

[GnatGoSplat]

Actually, what I meant was she couldn't see it, but she could see it after I pointed it out and after that, she couldn't miss it. However, I have to point it out to her every time because she can't find it on her own.

You guys are right though, the Z61t's are kind of rare. As far as Z61t's go, I do like it a lot, it seems noticeably lighter than my T43 and is a nice size.

I did decide to ask the seller if an exchange is possible since he has had several others to sell in the past. I'm leaning towards keeping it if he can't exchange it.
Here is a pic of the scratch:
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y15/Gn ... G_0882.jpg

I can't get a pic of it lit up since I drained the battery yesterday and need to buy an AC adapter if I decide to keep it.

There is something else weird with the laptop. When I first got it and opened it, a black piece of plastic fell out. I have no idea where it came from. Then I noticed in one of the latches was a little piece of gray plastic hanging out. I pulled it out gently with tweezers so it wouldn't fall back in. Here's a pic of the plastic parts, any idea where they came from?
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y15/Gn ... G_0883.jpg

[uux]

There is something else weird with the laptop. When I first got it and opened it, a black piece of plastic fell out. I have no idea where it came from. Then I noticed in one of the latches was a little piece of gray plastic hanging out. I pulled it out gently with tweezers so it wouldn't fall back in. Here's a pic of the plastic parts, any idea where they came from?
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y15/Gn ... G_0883.jpg

Just a guess, but those plastic pieces look like the parts from a single key mechanism in ThinkPad keyboards (the parts under the key cap).

[sparta.rising]

That's exactly what it is... without that mechanism the key shouldn't be attached... are you missing any keys? If not, the seller probably replaced a key and the piece fell behind a key.

[GnatGoSplat]

Ah, thanks. No, no keys are missing so I guess the keyboard has been replaced at some point. It does look brand new with no shine which I thought was unusual considering there are some scratches on the LCD bezel and right speaker area.

[GnatGoSplat]

Haha, just thought I'd update to say I'm crazy.

Since I drained the battery, I didn't even give myself the chance to see if I could get used to that little scratch.

Instead, I bid and won another Z61t on eBay for $430 shipped, kind of spur of the moment, not sure why I bid on it. It has half the RAM, half the HDD, but is a C2D 1.83GHz AND is under warranty until 2009-12-10. To upgrade the HDD and RAM is cheaper than it would have been to upgrade the 1.66GHz to 1.83GHz on my first one, so at the time it seemed like a good idea.

Anyway, I just got that laptop yesterday, and it's in overall better condition. The screen has no scratches, and there aren't any scratches on it anywhere. It only has wear on the keyboard (most commonly used keys are worn shiny). The screen seems to have a slightly yellowish hue compared to the first one. It has a problem though, it will intermittently just shut off. The screen will go black, and the computer will turn off. It even did this to me in BIOS a couple of times. It seems to do it most often after the computer has gotten warm. If I let it sit and cool for awhile, it'll boot up just fine. Sometimes when it shuts off, all the LEDs go out. If that happens, I have to unplug it and remove the battery in order to be able to turn it back on. Good thing this one is under warranty, I think I will have better results dealing with Lenovo than dealing with the seller. I just have concerns about how well Lenovo deals with intermittents that are difficult to reproduce. Also, does anyone know if Lenovo pays shipping both ways?

Oh, and even after I bought the 2nd one, I did another silly thing. I found one with the camera and titanium lid. Seller claimed it has a 2GHz C2D 2GB RAM, and 80GB HDD. The Type # he gave me doesn't seem to support this, but the serial # says it's a CTO machine so I guess it's possible. It's also under warranty until 2009-12-08. I got a pretty good price so it's no biggie if it's a lesser machine than advertised.

I'll be returning or selling 2 and keeping the best one.

[basketb]

... Also, does anyone know if Lenovo pays shipping both ways?...

They do. You call them, they send you a box w/prepaid shipping label. You ship your Thinkpad to them. They will send it back free of charge again.

If your Thinkpad overheats, it could be the fan. Do you know whether the fan actually works (i.e., do you use something like TPFanControl)?

[GnatGoSplat]

Thanks, sounds like dealing with Lenovo isn't too bad. Do they want to talk you through tech support first, or do they just take your word for it that it's broken? Just wondering if I need to have the laptop with me when I call.

Yeah, the fan does work, it seems to be blowing and I can hear its speed going up and down.

It seemed to shut off most often when I set it on my couch for a few minutes. I know that can reduce the amount of cooling, but the first Z61t and every other laptop I've had before didn't have any problems with being set on the sofa cushion for a few minutes.

[sparta.rising]

They ask for the type and serial number. When I am specific about a problem and its clearly hardware they just tell me they are going to ship a box.

[GnatGoSplat]

Gotta love (hate) eBay!
I got my 3rd Z61t today.
"Slightly used"... not really.
"Core 2 Duo 2000MHz"... not exactly.

The titanium lid and LCD looks brand new except for boogered up screw covers. The keyboard and palmrest look brand new as well. The bottom housing looks very worn, almost shiny with lots of scratches, labels scratched up. I'm not sure how a bottom housing ends up looking so worn, maybe it was used outdoors at a construction site. The bezel w/speakers also looks very worn. Shiny, with crust in all the tiny speaker holes like dead skin or something like that (nasty). Cleaning it with a toothbrush barely helped. All the screws on the bottom are almost to the point of being stripped. There is some wobble in the LCD hinges. Hard drive is the right size, but is a Toshiba with no Lenovo stickers. I guess this one is a Frankenstein consisting of a mix of new and old parts.

C2D 2GHz CPU is REALLY a T2400 Core Duo 1.83GHz. Overall, it's still a good laptop and with MS Live 30% off I didn't get totally ripped off, but unfortunately I didn't get quite the bargain I thought I did. This is a case where that saying "if it looks too good to be true" turned out to be the case.

Now I just need to decide which to keep and which to sell. I didn't think the titanium lid would be that exciting, but I think I might like it enough to be okay with the worn case bottom. It's tempting to mix & match parts to make a perfect laptop, but I'll have to resist because that'll void the warranties of the 2 that have it.