general security issues

[devanshoom]

man...best not go down that road...the subject of jews just makes people run around in circles.

At the end of the day Mullins is entitled to his opinions...he has delved far deeper into historical/esoteric matters than you or I so who knows what he may have stumbled across.

Makes you wonder though....the minute jews come into the frame everyone gets touchy and are quick to condemn.....if he had said that about muslims perhaps you wouldnt have thought twice about it.

[devanshoom]

actually...talking of nazism....i recently saw a very interesting documentary that had some very thought provoking information concerning the man adolf hitler....its not what i would call a conspiracy theory documentary, although some may view it in that light since it touches on some very esoteric stuff.

excellent viewing...i will get the link. Its in 2 parts and about 2.5 hours long so get some tea and biscuits ready. The main subject of the vid is atlantis no less.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 6123033330

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 0498984499

[ThinkRob]

Makes you wonder though....the minute jews come into the frame everyone gets touchy and are quick to condemn.....if he had said that about muslims perhaps you wouldnt have thought twice about it.

I would have.

I tend not to trust people who speak favorably of genocide, regardless of the targeted group. I'm willing to accept that I'm biased in this regard.

[crashnburn]

The Federal Reserve is an "independent" (i.e. privately owned) central bank. The "Board of Governors" etc. is merely the government body that regulates it to some extent. Who owns the Fed? The member banks do. Who owns the member banks? Their stockholders do. Who are the holders of the preferred/controlling stock of the member banks (and therefore, indirectly, the Fed)? Not the granny who has a few shares purchased through her broker. Banking bloodlines that have been in the racket since the Roman Empire own the controlling stock.

As they say, "Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not after you."

Wow! I knew something like this would be up... but had no idea that even the Federal Reserve was privately owned. lol!

[ThinkRob]

Wow! I knew something like this would be up... but had no idea that even the Federal Reserve was privately owned. lol!

Sigh. It's not.

Seriously, I don't know how I can better communicate this: the Federal Reserve is an independent government organization. Yes, I said "independent", but that simply refers to the fact that it (in theory) operates independently from the rest of the federal government.

It is not and has never been a privately-owned organization.

Unfortunately, a world in which the Federal Reserve is just another government organization is nowhere near as interesting as one in which there is a shadowy conspiracy of bankers working to oppress the working-class. I understand the appeal of that world -- conspiracies *are* entertaining, and it would be nice to automatically be a valiant member of the heroic citizenry fighting against a clearly-defined evil overlord -- but that's not the world in which we live.

[killer]

@ThinkRob: Please don't get too frustrated by all this stuff. You share my view that genocide is unacceptable ... for any reason. A refreshing opinion so thank you for that.

Ownership of the Federal Reserve (or any other national finance institution) seems to be out of our league. Even if we were unhappy about it, would we be able to change it?

Some people just want to wind others up. Maybe that is the real conspiracy behind conspiracy theories?

[devanshoom]

No one is trying to wind anyone up...its just discussion conducted in good spirit and of course people are going to have different opinions. This is a forum you know.....

[devanshoom]

anyway...enough of this hearsay and speculation

let the guy talk for himself....a 1 hour presentation by the late eustace mullins

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 3505156201#

[devanshoom]

Mullins talks about jews and the state of israel in this one

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 7453201814

[mpcook]

Well among other things, he states that Hitler saved the Jews from extermination, and that there was no holocaust. He seems to be of quite off the deep end to me. Given that, I'm not sure I would give credence to his other statements.

Mike

[Tõnis]

Sigh. It's not.

Seriously, I don't know how I can better communicate this: the Federal Reserve is an independent government organization. Yes, I said "independent", but that simply refers to the fact that it (in theory) operates independently from the rest of the federal government.

It is not and has never been a privately-owned organization.

In a nutshell, the Federal Reserve is a system of private banks that has been given the revocable license, via the Federal Reserve Act, to issue (and earn interest on!) the bulk of the nation's currency. It is not a part of the government. If it were, it would be a national bank. Currency would be issued by and interest would be paid to the government. At any time, Congress can repeal the act thereby revoking the "license" much to the bankers' chagrin. Is the system regulated? To a certain extent. But if one follows the money, its practical "ownership" becomes apparent. Private parties pocket the interest on every dollar in existence.

[ThinkRob]

In a nutshell, the Federal Reserve is a system of private banks that has been given the revocable license, via the Federal Reserve Act, to issue (and earn interest on!) the bulk of the nation's currency. It is not a part of the government. If it were, it would be a national bank. Currency would be issued by and interest would be paid to the government. At any time, Congress can repeal the act thereby revoking the "license" much to the bankers' chagrin. Is the system regulated? To a certain extent. But if one follows the money, its practical "ownership" becomes apparent. Private parties pocket the interest on every dollar in existence.

I suppose there might be some confusion over terminology. The "Federal Reserve" can be used to refer to either the entire Federal Reserve system -- which does, as you correctly explained -- consist of a dozen private banks, operating under license (and fairly strict control) by the government. Alternately (and this is how I suppose I thought of the term) "Federal Reserve" can refer to the managing body that licenses and controls the actions of those banks. The latter is indeed very much a government organization.

All in all, while the system is quite unusual, I don't really see it as any grand conspiracy to line the pockets of a shadowy cabal.

Some people just want to wind others up. Maybe that is the real conspiracy behind conspiracy theories?

As others have said: follow the money. There is very, very good money to be made by catering to the small, but vocal minority that believe in various conspiracies. It's fairly easy work too. The bar for proof is much lower (after all, were there a conspiracy, the conspirators would undoubtedly try to suppress the evidence), and it's easy to by hype by marketing yourself as a noble fact-finder out to expose what "'they' don't want you to know" (for varying values of "they").

Think of it this way: if the information on various conspiracies was *so* solid and *so* vital that everyone should have access to it, why are most "expository" books sold for a profit?

[devanshoom]

Well among other things, he states that Hitler saved the Jews from extermination, and that there was no holocaust. He seems to be of quite off the deep end to me. Given that, I'm not sure I would give credence to his other statements.

Mike

holocaust "denial" is more widespread than you might think.....just doesnt get much airtime so it sounds a bit "off the deep end".

Anyway you can split hairs all you want...doesnt change the fact mullins was held in high regard by many academics and fellow researchers and considered an expert in his field.....That, plus the fact many people in high places saw fit to try shut him up numerous times, including the head of the FBI, suggests that the guy was no mug.

BTW...I didnt hear anything in those vids to suggest he is a jew hater or pro-holocaust or whatever.....he is definitely anti zionist though yes.




.

[mpcook]

Well he did say that Hitler saved the Jews from being exterminated, and he did say that all Jews are Israelis. You can draw your own conclusions about the man's scholarly capability.

Mike

[devanshoom]

Well he did say that Hitler saved the Jews from being exterminated, and he did say that all Jews are Israelis. You can draw your own conclusions about the man's scholarly capability.

Mike

Scholarly capabilities? LOL.....

well I just think the guy has defended himself in court several times, gone toe-to-toe with the IRS and the FBI, wrote a bunch of books, speaks in front of audiences and on radios shows, was a student of ezra pound, would rather sit in a library all day than watch wrestling or HBO movies, so he's obviously not some sort of retard.

[Tõnis]

I think a typical dirty tactic available to anyone is to paint an opposing party as an anti-Semite. No one likes an anti-Semite, so if I were to use dirty tactics, and were to call my opposition an anti-Semite -- especially if he makes any negative statement about Israel -- it would probably work in my favor by swaying many non-thinking people to my side. In line with that, if I were to talk negatively about the Federal Reserve, and also if I were to say that I think the United States should stop all military and financial aid of Israel, both those who think that the Federal Reserve is wonderful and those who favor US welfare support of Israel could smear me as an anti-Semite to try to discredit me. I'm not an anti-Semite. I like the Jews I know. But I do think the US should stop sending military and financial aid to Israel (and other countries, too!). Look for me soon to be branded an anti-Semite because of these statements.

[dsvochak]

http://www.ustreas.gov/education/faq/cu ... nder.shtml

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Reserve_System

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Reserve_Bank

I'm really surprised none of the above reference The Soylent Corporation, which (as everyone likely already knows) is the real power behind the curtain.

[mpcook]

I think a typical dirty tactic available to anyone is to paint an opposing party as an anti-Semite. No one likes an anti-Semite, so if I were to use dirty tactics, and were to call my opposition an anti-Semite -- especially if he makes any negative statement about Israel -- it would probably work in my favor by swaying many non-thinking people to my side. In line with that, if I were to talk negatively about the Federal Reserve, and also if I were to say that I think the United States should stop all military and financial aid of Israel, both those who think that the Federal Reserve is wonderful and those who favor US welfare support of Israel could smear me as an anti-Semite to try to discredit me. I'm not an anti-Semite. I like the Jews I know. But I do think the US should stop sending military and financial aid to Israel (and other countries, too!). Look for me soon to be branded an anti-Semite because of these statements.

I don't know if you were referring to my comments above, but as I stated, Mullins claims that Hitler saved the Jews from extermination, and that there was no holocaust. This does not on the face of it make him an anti-Semite. Although in my opinion, it makes him a dishonest historian. I'm sure the fellow is intelligent, just greatly misguided, possibly even deranged to believe in Hitler's benign intentions toward the Jewish population of Europe.

Mike

[Tõnis]

I don't know if you were referring to my comments above ...

No, I was just contributing to the discussion in a general sense. But outside the "matter of Mullins," I've personally experienced the type of smearing I referenced in my post. It happens all the time on political discussion boards.

Tony

[devanshoom]

well looks like we are destined to disagree on the mullins thing ... I guess the best thing is to just look at everything from all angles and try keep an open mind.

I still find the guy dam interesting, and on a gut level he comes across as very candid and for the most part genuine...he doesnt have that shifty calculated look about him like a lot of politicians do when talking...if you have ever seen donald rumsfeld talking about Iraq you will know what i am getting at.

Below is something else for anyone with an hour or two to spare...Id be greatly interested to hear what you all think about this documentary.....its been around for about 3 years now and has always been available to watch free on google.

The link is below and its well worth the effort to check out.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 1381895251#

[devanshoom]

actually this one is better..the one above has polish subtitles! This one is just plain english with no subtitles.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 2797444340

the president kennedy speech bit near the start gives me goosebumps......i think he was a truly great man and the last "real" president.

[bill bolton]

The Soylent Corporation, which (as everyone likely already knows) is the real power behind the curtain.

And there I was thinking it was the Acme Corporation! beep, beep!

Cheers,

Bill B.

[devanshoom]

i see your in oz so here's one for you bill...this is a absolute classic! just 3 minutes

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qtd7o9x5 ... re=related

i used to live in sydney...spent a year there on a 1 year working visa...pendle hill and bankstown mostly. Im gutted I never really made the effort to see more of the country cos i doubt i will ever be going back...the furthest i got from sydney was the blue mountains! I was only 25 at the time and so I was able to run down those metal stairs to the bottom and then back up again just for the hell of it....LOL man those were the days.

[mediasponge]

And there I was thinking it was the Acme Corporation! beep, beep!

Don't forget Omni Consumer Products (OCP).

One of the vintage computers in my collection is a 3270 AT/GX, which came with a copy of IBM's (I kid you not) Master Control Program (MCP)!

[dsvochak]

In the new math: the Soylent Corporation + the Acme Corporation + Omni Consumer Products = The Trilateral Commission!

[j-dawg]

I can no longer sit back and allow Communist infiltration, Communist indoctrination, Communist subversion and the international Communist conspiracy to sap and impurify all of our precious bodily fluids.

[mediasponge]

LOL! Purity Of Essence!
The 60's were a great time for movies to make you afraid of the bomb. "You know, Dmitri, the Hydrogen Bomb." There was Dr. Strangelove, Fail-Safe, and The Bedford Incident. The Bedford Incident has some of the finest acting by Richard Widmark and Sidney Poitier.

[devanshoom]

always baffles me why that film "doctor strangelove" often comes out in peoples top 10 all time greatest film list. I thought it was very ordinary.

Best 60s film HAS to be butch cassidy and the sundance kid...I watched it again the other week and loved it, despite seeing it 2 times previously.

[Navck]

What I would be more worried about is how everyone leaves a little virtual paper trail behind about who they are, where they live and their phone numbers... Basically, social networking and unguarded behavior will nail people way before Orwellian style super surveillance.

Oh, right, closed versus open OS? Why don't you go worry about this first:
http://lambda-diode.com/electronics/tempest/
http://www.tscm.com/TSCM101tempest.html
http://www.eskimo.com/~joelm/tempest.html
http://www.erikyyy.de/tempest/

And no, having a LCD is not safe. I recommend a shielded room, if you feel that paranoid. Might as well build an entire faraday cage too, then you won't have to worry about EMP attacks from terrorists (And no, this isn't as big of a threat as they make it on TV) don't forget to unplug and use a nice power conditioner/UPS.

[killer]

@Navck: Faraday cages are becoming common place in the UK due to insurance companies demanding that houses meet this requirement when a wiring inspection is done. Apparently it is a really good thing for safety. I'm not into all this over-protective nanny stuff but the Faraday cage makes a lot of sense.

However, all this paranoia about intrusions is enough to make me want to wear the tin-foil helmet before going to bed.