R40 - some minutes after boot freezes // Keyboard error?

[jwege]

Hi all,

since a few days on the machine of my wife, strange behaviour.

Machine: R40 Type 2727 CDG / 1GB / XPPro
NOTING changed / installed at the time the error first occured.

Problem:
TP starts up, Starts WinXP - all seems ok. After a while (details see below) the Machine freezes and just pressing the power button SHORT (that normally brings up the selection what to do) the TP simply switches off the machine.

DETAILS:
1st stage of problem - after a few seconds in WinXP: Mouse moves and position is detected (i.e. colorchange on mose-over) but no left/right click possible.

2nd stage - after little more time (maybe other 2 minutes): the mouse over is not detected anymore, mouse still moves

3rd stage - again little time passed: no mouse movement anymore, but pressing the power button SHORT does not do anything, no mouse movement, no keyboard

4th stage - after again little tim( in sum maybe 3-4 mins after boot): When pressing the poser button SHORT (normally the menu for that action will appear), the TP switches off instantly

MORE INFO:
Having (for testing) attached a Mouse & Keyboard to the Dock, the system seems to work properly - at least for 2 hours now vs. a few minutes without.

Sine I have thought it could be a contact problem or similar, I tried to force the error by pressing on the keyboard of the TP - and, yes, the machine "died" doing this.

ANY help with that?
Thanks so much
Juergen

[Harryc]

You have a loose southbridge problem. It's time for a new systemboard. There is a repair outfit in the UK that can fix it as well ...

http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=73945

[RealBlackStuff]

Sounds mostly like a defective Southbridge.
And I've never heard of anyone pressing the Power button to get a "mouse menu" or whatever you expect...
Power is for switching On/Off, nothing else!

[jwege]

uuurgh ... no other way?

Having a good number of (older) IBM notebooks, I share powersupply, docks etc. on various loctions.

Any tips on how to determine if that is really the problem (known "press here" points or similar ).

I am an Electronics person also with Soldering capbilities etc., so, any fixing help tips very welcome also!

@RealBlackStuff: Normally I have set up my TP'S to show that menu "Shutdown/Hibernate/..." if the power button is pressed. But on that defective machine, this menu does not appear, also no "shutdown" is done (normally takes a few seconds and the HD works). At that machine, Monitor off and that's it.

Thanks!
Juergen

[RealBlackStuff]

You could try swapping out the keyboard first.
R40 was made by Acer, where QC was probably not always as tight as under IBM.
Remove keyboard and palm rest. Somewhere you'll find a big chip with Intel on it (this will be the Southbridge, not the CPU). Press on various corners to see if things work better.

[jwege]

Thanks @RealBlackStuff.

I have now found out that in deed, it seems to be a matter of somewhere of the palmrest. So, I fear that you guys are right ... will investigate further.

Am I right that you think ist is a soldering problem? Because if so, if the machine is broken anyhow, i could try doing reflowing - have an electronic lab and bit experience also. Major Q is if I will be able to see the soldering points or if they are "underneath". Any hint on that (have not openned the TP so far).

Thanks again!
Juergen

[RealBlackStuff]

Chances of doing this successful in DIY are rare. You won't see the ca. 500 (!) contacts that need to be reflowed/reballed.
IMHO the R40 is too old to waste much money on and send it out for a professional job.
Good luck.

[jwege]

IMHO the R40 is too old to waste much money on and send it out for a professional job.

Truly true, oh, so true!

The only trouble I have is that I have so many of these Items everywhere and so much "comfort" because all of them share thesame power supplies, docks etc that I have at home, the store, at the parents, in the summer cottage etc. that makes it a pain to start using other PC'S.

But maybe that will be the kick-off ... my wife votes for an Apple for long ...

Thanks again, folks!
Juergen

[Bruce Guttman]

jwege, if you have experience with soldering and a good heat gun, look in the T4x section about resoldering the Graphics Chip, which was attempted to fix many of the problems with the early T40, T41, and T42 machines. The chip is attached using something called a "Ball Grid Array" where the connections are a bunch of spheres covered with solder located under the chip. You have to apply heat with a heat gun (carefully; you can "fry" the chip if you are too aggressive, and you can not re-reflow if you are not aggressive enough) and bring the solder joint temperature to above freezing and you can get everything to reconnect (we always hope).

The R40 is different from the R5x and T4x series; it looks more like the R3x and T3x family. I have one that I keep on hand because it still uses the Ultrabay 2000 devices (I have a floppy and a ZIP) and also has the IEEE 1394 interface for those devices that need it.

Your IBM adapters (assuming they are all 16v 4.5a) will work with the T2x, T3x, T4x, R3x, R40, and R5x systems. Maybe more. A nice R-52 wouldn't be terribly expensive and would work nearly twice as fast as the old R40. Then again, there are an awful lot of R40s flooding Ebay right now.

[RealBlackStuff]

If anyone is in for a good R52, see The Board Room link in my signature.

[jwege]

Hey guys,

thanks for all the comments!

Bruce, I will have a look - maybe with a little luck I can reanimate the machine. Soldering should not be the problem having a lab and doing lots of electronics (including some smd projects).

One last question if my efforts on soldeing should fail:

Is the 1400 x 1050 screen panel of the R40 (Type: 2722-CDG) compatible with that one in an R52 (Type: 1846-AQG)?

Because if I need to give the R40 up, I have a R52 running as a small server for music UPNP and this has a broken screen in need for a replace. It started with a few lines vertically but has meanwhile 50+ lines (on the right hand side's 1/3rd only) showing different colors in stead of the screen's content. Maybe I can use the R40's panel as a replacement part?

Thanks again!
Juergen

[RealBlackStuff]

The R40 and R5x LCDs have the same size and thickness.
The R40 SXGA+ LCD is a Samsung LTN150P4-L01
The pin connectors are the same size and in the same place, but I don't know if they are pin-compatible.
The XGA screens from R4x and R5x/T4x are interchangeable.
Hence I would assume that SXGA+ works both ways as well, but no guarantee.
If you do this swap, please report back if it works.

[jwege]

Thanks for the info!

For sure will report back if I do the swap!

Juergen