[Confirmed] First HP, now Dell offering IPS option. Lenovo?

[gaphic2]

Read this on a Dutch forum. A guy there attended a presentation last week on the upcoming Dell Precision business models. He saw a slide detailing an IPS option.

I might be weird, but for me a notebook needs two things, an IPS LCD and PgUp/PgDwn keys above the arrows.

Early days yet, no confirmation. If this turns out to be true, I might go for it. I mean, is it even realistic to wait for Lenovo to pull its finger out?

[dr_st]

I might be weird, but for me a notebook needs two things, an IPS LCD and PgUp/PgDwn keys above the arrows.

Do you mean in the classic arrangement above the reverse-T, like in the Thinkpads and the older DELL business laptops, or above the keypad as in the new Precisions?

[ZaZ]

I mean, is it even realistic to wait for Lenovo to pull its finger out?

One can only hope. Right now the HPs with the Dreamcolor 2 LCD are pretty expensive and the Precisions aren't cheap either. I'm hoping for the day when you can buy a regular notebook like a X201, T410 or T510 with one of those screens.

[gaphic2]

Do you mean in the classic arrangement above the reverse-T, like in the Thinkpads and the older DELL business laptops, or above the keypad as in the new Precisions?

You're right, it's odd. Definitely the Thinkpad layout. The current Dells don't have this layout, but I was looking at pictures from Endgadget http://www.engadget.com/photos/dell-lat ... n/#3860036 and http://www.engadget.com/photos/dell-lat ... 1/#3858210

[pianowizard]

If this turns out to be true, I might go for it. I mean, is it even realistic to wait for Lenovo to pull its finger out?

Yeah, just go for it. I bought a Dell Precision M90 (17.0" WUXGA) earlier this month and love it. Dell's Precisions and Latitudes are fine machines. But make sure you open and close the lid gently, since Dell laptops tend to have relatively weak hinges.

If Lenovo were continuing their W70* series, then the W702 might get an IPS option. But I read somewhere on this forum that it's getting discontinued.

[gaphic2]

If Lenovo were continuing their W70* series, then the W702 might get an IPS option. But I read somewhere on this forum that it's getting discontinued.

Is this info based on more than just dropping stock levels? It's hard to believe Lenovo would bow out of the 17" mobile workstation market.

[ZaZ]

It could show up on the W520 like the 8540w has the Dreamcolor 2 option.

[gaphic2]

Managed to get a look at the slide. It says the 2 precision workstations have a 'PremierColor technology' option. As far as I know, that's the name Dell uses for its IPS monitors.

Or are there TN PremierColor monitors as well?

[khtse]

What are the sizes of those IPS panels?

As far as I recall, the reason why IBM/Lenovo discontinued Flexview screens was due to supply issue. If there is a manufacturer that can reliably supply a large quantity of those IPS panels, then this is not a problem anymore. But the same supply issue haunts other big manufacturers like HP and Dell. Since they are both offer IPS panels... that could mean Lenovo can do so as well.

[beeblebrox]

If Lenovo were continuing their W70* series, then the W702 might get an IPS option. But I read somewhere on this forum that it's getting discontinued.

Is this info based on more than just dropping stock levels? It's hard to believe Lenovo would bow out of the 17" mobile workstation market.

lookf at www.51nb.com and the Lenovo 2011/2012 Thinkpad roadmap. The W7xx is dead in the water.
I wish I knew what this new X1 Series might be.

[sanjuro]

lookf at http://www.51nb.com and the Lenovo 2011/2012 Thinkpad roadmap. The W7xx is dead in the water.
I wish I knew what this new X1 Series might be.

X1 may be a rumored competitor from Lenovo to Macbook Air from Apple.

[gaphic2]

I've only now seen the Feb 22 announcement of the new Thinkpads.

In a response, Matt Kohut says:

"To keep 4:3 or even 16:10 would easily drive a $75 – $100 cost premium and despite the vocal cries here on this blog, THERE JUST AREN’T ENOUGH OF YOU WILLING TO PAY THE PREMIUM. We have to make money, and our target corporate customers won’t pay."

And a few reactions down, someone comments:

Gaaah, people, you need to understand the markets Lenovo and Apple are in.

Apple is mostly retail at premium prices. They sell less, but mark up more. They also have a very strong brand, and far more fanatical and numerous followers.

Lenovo does corporate for Thinkpads, and it’s an area where they have lost a lot of businesses (I have been noting a decreasing number of Thinkpads in many large companies).

IT support might appreciate Thinkpads, but they don’t sign the checks. The bean counters do, and usually they are the ones who force the decision to drop Lenovo in favour of say, HP or Dell.

Can Lenovo make a change to the premium level they used to occupy? Maybe, maybe not, but corporate purchasing culture needs to change, consumer culture needs to change (plenty of people don’t like Thinkpad’s design), and Lenovo strategic direction needs to change: They are not quite set up to deal with retail that well, from my experience here.

So very true. We still don't know if the W520 will share an IPS option with the upcoming Dell Precision 4600.

Tragically, the brands Lenovo is losing to on their key corporate accounts are also the ones being able to start offering the new IPS option.

Im starting a thread for guidance on how to proceed here.

[ajkula66]

gaphic2 wrote:

So very true. We still don't know if the W520 will share an IPS option with the upcoming Dell Precision 4600.

Tragically, the brands Lenovo is losing to on their key corporate accounts are also the ones being able to start offering the new IPS option.

I'd beg to differ...

I'm going to be extremely politically incorrect and say that a large number of accounts was lost the moment ThinkPad name became associated with Lenovo. No one will ever openly admit to it, but the old saying was that no one ever got fired for buying IBM...not Lenovo...

The second big "hit" was transition from 4:3 to 16:10. Unfortunately for Lenovo, at that point in the game they really were not ahead of competition in any respect when it came to "mainstream" laptops such as T and R series...and the nVidia debacle (along with Lenovo's intial response or shall we say lack thereof) hasn't helped the whole situation whatsoever...

Finally, I see more ToughBooks and Macs than HPs and Dells being used by the companies that utilized exclusively ThinkPads a decade or so ago...it's not about the money, for the most part...a lot of other things comes into play, and the vast majority of former IBM corporate clients couldn't care less about how much a laptop costs...

My $0.02 only...

[dr_st]

I'm going to be extremely politically incorrect and say that a large number of accounts was lost the moment ThinkPad name became associated with Lenovo. No one will ever openly admit to it, but the old saying was that no one ever got fired for buying IBM...not Lenovo...

True on both accounts.

[Puppy]

Finally, I see more ToughBooks and Macs than HPs and Dells being used by the companies that utilized exclusively ThinkPads a decade or so ago...it's not about the money, for the most part...

The only ThinkPad model I've seen used in companies is X200/201 series. Otherwise Dell workstations and Macs are the company 'mainstream' over here now. Dell does not look that bad but its keyboard feel is just horrible comparing to Lenovo X series or old IBM keyboards on R/T.

Dell also offers custom configuration while Lenovo provides pre-configured models only over here. I took ages to get ThinkPad configuration with integrated WWAN, for example.

[khtse]

I'm going to be extremely politically incorrect and say that a large number of accounts was lost the moment ThinkPad name became associated with Lenovo. No one will ever openly admit to it, but the old saying was that no one ever got fired for buying IBM...not Lenovo...

But the gigantic number of account gained in China probably outweigh that, by a large margin.

[pianowizard]

But the gigantic number of account gained in China probably outweigh that, by a large margin.

While you could be right, I wouldn't automatically assume that because: 1) Thinkpads are very expensive in China, and 2) the Chinese tend to prefer imports over domestic products.

[penartur]

From what i have heard, the Chinese tend to prefer ThinkPads greatly over everything else. So the higher price in China should give Lenovo a large profit.

[ajkula66]

khtse wrote:

But the gigantic number of account gained in China probably outweigh that, by a large margin.

Maybe, but that is not the point I was trying to make...

What we've seen during the transition from IBM to Lenovo is a 270 degree switch when it comes to target market. IBM was business of any kind, big business, small business, government. Lenovo's orientation is primarily towards the consumer segment.

Since no one is really that stupid, HP, Dell, Panasonic and Apple (the latter in a somewhat different manner) went in for the kill and pretty much accomplished the mission as intended. But what Lenovo's top people seem to have finally realized is that they do need the business segment of the market - or a part thereof - so they could successfully market their "non-business" range...because the power of ThinkPad name - if by inertia only - is still a force to be reckoned with.

Don't get me wrong, I'm happy to see that IPS is coming back to ThinkPads, even in 1366x768 guise...may that be a start in reversing some of that 270 degree turn that I was referring to previously...

My $0.02 only...

[bill bolton]

My $0.02 only...

So, what's with the "What we've seen" then?

[ajkula66]

bill bolton wrote:

So, what's with the "What we've seen" then?

Well...we've seen what we've seen, but I never claim to have the crystal ball that allows me to see what the future will bring...hence the mere two cents worth of my opinion on what it might bring...

[bill bolton]

Well...we've seen what we've seen...

Again, you seem very ready to promote your own strongly held beliefs as somehow, magically, being universal.

[ajkula66]

bill bolton wrote:

Again, you seem very ready to promote your own strongly held beliefs as somehow, magically, being universal.

And I will keep on doing so until someone proves me wrong with verifiable data...

[bill bolton]

And I will keep on doing so until someone proves me wrong with verifiable data...

ROFL

So its OK to make assertions based on no data at all, verifiable or otherwise, but verifiable data is required to refute them...

[ajkula66]

bill bolton wrote:

So its OK to make assertions based on no data at all, verifiable or otherwise, but verifiable data is required to refute them...

I can provide you with names of at least two dozen Fortune 500 companies that dropped ThinkPads after transition to Lenovo. Not to mention several U.S. government entities.

Not to get personal - since I do respect the fact that you're an Admin and there must be a reason for it - but you've never ever provided any type of verifiable data in all the little ping-pong games that we've played on TPF and Lenovo's forum over the course of years...

[bill bolton]

but you've never ever provided any type of verifiable data in all the little ping-pong games that we've played on TPF and Lenovo's forum over the course of years...

Neither have you....... but I don't make a habit of presenting my personal opinions as if the were "we" beliefs.

The simple fact is no matter what limited data you may think you have about some US business usage of ThinkPads, its not representative of anything except what you can see, not the global business market by any means at all.

[ajkula66]

Being the junior entity in this discussion, I'm going to bow out of it in order not to hijack this thread any further...

Let's just enjoy the fact that IPS is coming back to ThinkPads for now...

[Oliver26n]

PremierColor is NOT IPS. It's Dell's name for switchable color profiles, like the Dreamcolor on the HP's. If Dell doesn't say it's IPS, it isn't. Who would pass up the chance to promote that? Heck, they'd boast about it being PVA.

I have both the Dreamcolor 2 8740w and a FHD W510. If a W520 had switchable color profiles, that would be enough for me to buy it. The current FHD LCD is great in every other way, in my opinion.

[gaphic2]

PremierColor is NOT IPS. It's Dell's name for switchable color profiles, like the Dreamcolor on the HP's. If Dell doesn't say it's IPS, it isn't. Who would pass up the chance to promote that? Heck, they'd boast about it being PVA.

Well, it took a while but Dell's bragging about it now.

"It also offers astonishing 15.6” HD and FHD display options, including a PremierColor 100% color correct RGB LED display with IPS technology, for accurate color reproduction and brilliant images."

So, will Lenovo be so kind as to offer the same option, or do we need to resort to warranty voiding DIY?

[Oliver26n]

I see that. It's on the new M6600 and M4600. Not on the 4500 or 6500. However, I read somewhere that these will be 24 bit displays. All true professional imaging monitors, including the Dreamcolor 2 on the HP, are capable of 30 bit color or better. I believe some of the EIZOs can do 12 or 14 bits per channel. Remains to be seen how good these displays really are. I have nothing but bad memories on the Dell Controlpoint software; I would much rather have a 15" W-series from lenovo with a IPS color-managed type display. Unless they have changed something, the Dells also scratched really easily.