Production years of T42?

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Deckard · #1 Post by **Deckard** » Sun Mar 06, 2011 6:07 am

Does anyone know until when the T42 was built? According to information I found on the net, it was launched sometime in mid-2004, but couldn't find out when IBM stopped the production.

#2 Post by **RealBlackStuff** » Sun Mar 06, 2011 8:33 am

Some models were already withdrawn in May/October 2005, the majority was withdrawn in May 2006, and the last models were withdrawn in October 2006.

Deckard · #3 Post by **Deckard** » Sun Mar 06, 2011 8:52 am

Thank you very much.

w0qj · #4 Post by **w0qj** » Sun Mar 06, 2011 12:28 pm

To put this into perspective, the T43 was launched and available around May'2005.

Nicola · #5 Post by **Nicola** » Tue Mar 08, 2011 12:15 pm

The end of the computer division of IBM is 30th March 2005.
But I do not know if the first computer produced after this period they still had the quality of IBM. Surely after the summer of 2005 laptops were built with less quality.

ThinkRob · #6 Post by **ThinkRob** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 12:53 am

Nicola wrote:The end of the computer division of IBM is 30th March 2005.
But I do not know if the first computer produced after this period they still had the quality of IBM. Surely after the summer of 2005 laptops were built with less quality.

There is absolutely no evidence that quality changed during the course of the T4x production run.

Nicola · #7 Post by **Nicola** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 4:15 am

Sure!
IBM sold its computer because the prices are lowered even more. And I remember the reviews of new families of Lenovo Thinkpad, less quality.
Moreover, even the latest IBM laptops were less good. I have a T23 and T42. The base of the monitor, the cd-rom bay, the T23 has much more quality of T42.

dr_st · #8 Post by **dr_st** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 6:32 am

For every reviewer that said that Lenovo-era Thinkpads are of lower quality compared to IBM, there is one that will claim it's the other way around. So I choose to just ignore them altogether.

The quality of the T23 did not prevent their characteristic bezel breakage problem. The much-touted quality of T4x series is considered almost a joke around these parts now, after several years of GPU/southbridge detachment issues.

Most members of this forum, at least those who have used a significant number of Thinkpads for a significant time will agree that the Lenovo-built T60 series is of significantly greater quality and durability than the lovable but fragile T4x.

How good are the current ones? Only time will tell.

ajkula66 · #9 Post by **ajkula66** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 11:41 am

Let me review the current stock...

a) T40p (2373-KU1) made in Mexico, late 2003. No signs of ailments as far as I can see. I've upgraded it slightly but have done no mods on it, still runs on what appears to be the original motherboard with no red dots. Even if it were to fail tomorrow (God forbid) its lifespan can be described as satisfactory at the very least.

b) T43 (2686-M7U) made in China, late 2005. Had the wireless card and one of the DIMMs fail, otherwise holds up well in daily use. Needs new keyboard and palmrest, but that's about to be expected after five years...

c) T43p (2668-VQ7) made in U.S., late 2006 - got two of these, one of them being my main machine. Nothing to report apart from signs of normal aging in the plastics department.

All of that said, T4x generation got better along the way, if anything...I still believe that post-March 2005 machines with "red dots" fail less than the previous ones, although one of this forum's premium service providers has a different opinion - we'll just agree to disagree...

As for the post-IBM ThinkPads, I've owned many and my main gripe was the screen quality - but I had complained about non-IPS ThinkPads in that respect even before the sale of PC Division to Lenovo...apart from that, most of these units are well-worthy of ThinkPad name in my opinion...

Let's not go over the weak spots that every single generation of ThinkPads produced over the last decade exhibited, regardless of logo...

ThinkRob · #10 Post by **ThinkRob** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 2:56 pm

Nicola wrote: IBM sold its computer because the prices are lowered even more. And I remember the reviews of new families of Lenovo Thinkpad, less quality.

People find what they're looking for. Lots of people look at the Lenovo-branded ThinkPads with a skeptical eye, assuming that their Chinese ownership will inherently mean lower quality, worse reliability, etc. Surprise, surprise, if you go into your ownership experience expecting to find "proof" of that, you probably will. Of course, those same folks could probably similar evidence on an IBM-made ThinkPad as well, but they undoubtedly wouldn't be looking for it because "everyone knows IBM didn't 'cheap out'", etc.

Oh, and lest there be any confusion: Lenovo was responsible for the manufacturing of the entire T42 line, even the ones produced when the brand was owned by IBM. Same factories, same suppliers, and (AFAIK) even the same production lines.

sktn77a · #11 Post by **sktn77a** » Sun Mar 13, 2011 8:21 pm

I can believe that IBM sold its PC/Laptop division to Lenovo because margins were falling below that consistent with their business model. However, re: quality, didn't Lenovo manufacture most of IBMs laptops after about 2002 (and maybe even before)?

ajkula66 · #12 Post by **ajkula66** » Sun Mar 13, 2011 9:49 pm

sktn77a wrote:

However, re: quality, didn't Lenovo manufacture most of IBMs laptops after about 2002 (and maybe even before)?

The production was moved from Mexico to China in late 2003 to early 2004, for the machines that were sold on the U.S. market. A lot of European-model production was done from IBM's Greenock plant in Scotland, but that seized about the same time, I believe - don't have the first hand knowledge of these dates.

ThinkRob · #13 Post by **ThinkRob** » Sun Mar 13, 2011 10:12 pm

I know Winstron was doing some of the manufacturing prior to the Lenovo acquisition. Also, IIRC the entire i series was outsourced to Acer.

ajkula66 · #14 Post by **ajkula66** » Sun Mar 13, 2011 10:24 pm

ThinkRob wrote:

Also, IIRC the entire i series was outsourced to Acer.

Correct. Acer was also responsible for entire production of R30, R31, R32, R40/e, G40, G41 and G50 (most people have never heard of the last machine on this list and I'd absolutely LOVE to get my hands on one...

)

ThinkRob · #15 Post by **ThinkRob** » Mon Mar 14, 2011 11:42 am

ajkula66 wrote:[...] G50 (most people have never heard of the last machine on this list and I'd absolutely LOVE to get my hands on one... )

That would be the only post-acquisition G series produced, wouldn't it? Interesting... AFAIK it would also be unique in that it is the only chassis design originating under IBM's ownership which was not replaced during the Pentium M -> Core Duo transition.

Nicola · #16 Post by **Nicola** » Mon Mar 14, 2011 12:26 pm

When I inquired as to which model to buy T42, I read that only 2376 models had four-year warranty, and they were all "made in Japan". Curious that the ThinkPad sold in Japan were sold with a one year warranty. I guess for their laws.
In Italy all the products sold have a minimum two-year warranty. How is in the United States?

ajkula66 · #17 Post by **ajkula66** » Mon Mar 14, 2011 9:39 pm

Nicola wrote:

In Italy all the products sold have a minimum two-year warranty. How is in the United States?

T4x generation was available with a 1-year or a 3-year warranty depending on the model number. Any of these could have been extended at the time to a maximum of five years.

ThinkRob wrote:

That would be the only post-acquisition G series produced, wouldn't it? Interesting... AFAIK it would also be unique in that it is the only chassis design originating under IBM's ownership which was not replaced during the Pentium M -> Core Duo transition.

An excellent observation - not that I ever doubt you - with one small correction: in case of G series, it was actually a transition from Pentium 4 (not P4M, these were desktop CPUs, most of them HT) to Core Duo...quite wild...

I've never seen one in person, but would love to know whether they've kept the awkward AC adapter from the original G series or switched to the new ones...as well as whether they've kept the keyboard intact or added the "windows" key...

ThinkRob · #18 Post by **ThinkRob** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 9:25 am

ajkula66 wrote: An excellent observation - not that I ever doubt you - with one small correction: in case of G series, it was actually a transition from Pentium 4 (not P4M, these were desktop CPUs, most of them HT) to Core Duo...quite wild...

Ach! I knew that...

I remember reading about the G40 when it was released and thinking "P-4? Really? That thing must be hot..."

I've never seen one in person, but would love to know whether they've kept the awkward AC adapter from the original G series or switched to the new ones...as well as whether they've kept the keyboard intact or added the "windows" key...

I believe the G50 shares keyboard and AC FRUs with its predecessor, but don't quote me on that. Amazingly, there is no HMM published (or at least none that I can find) for the G50, so confirming this is tricky.

#19 Post by **RealBlackStuff** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 10:16 am

G50 uses the same size brick as the T60/R60
P/N or FRU: 93P5026 20V-4.5A

dr_st · #20 Post by **dr_st** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 11:19 am

Interesting.

The keyboard seems to be the old IBM keyboard, though, with no Windows keys and gray function keys (look up pictures on the web).

ThinkRob · #21 Post by **ThinkRob** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 11:29 pm

RealBlackStuff wrote:G50 uses the same size brick as the T60/R60
P/N or FRU: 93P5026 20V-4.5A

Huh. Well, I'm wrong on 1/2. Ah well. I assumed that since the chassis seemed to be mostly the same, the adapter would.

exTPfan · #22 Post by **exTPfan** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 7:08 pm

Forget the anecdotes. When IBM made them, Thinkpads consistently received top ratings in reliability surveys by PC World etc.; now they receive mediocre ratings.

ThinkRob · #23 Post by **ThinkRob** » Fri Mar 18, 2011 8:32 pm

exTPfan wrote:Forget the anecdotes. When IBM made them, Thinkpads consistently received top ratings in reliability surveys by PC World etc.; now they receive mediocre ratings.

Counterpoints: The T60 series received stellar ratings, as did the T43p.

Also, keep in mind: the entire PC industry was wildly different throughout most of IBM's ownership of the brand. There's a big difference between products designed to compete in a business-driven industry where the average cost of a laptop is 2,000 USD+ and products designed to compete in a consumer-driven one where 500 USD laptops are commonplace.

sktn77a · #24 Post by **sktn77a** » Wed Mar 30, 2011 10:07 pm

ajkula66 wrote:The production was moved from Mexico to China in late 2003 to early 2004, for the machines that were sold on the U.S. market.

George:

My early 2003 T40 came directly from China (I tracked its progress as I patiently waited for its delivery), and it was built by Lenovo.

ajkula66 · #25 Post by **ajkula66** » Wed Mar 30, 2011 10:20 pm

sktn77a wrote:

George:

My early 2003 T40 came directly from China (I tracked its progress as I patiently waited for its delivery), and it was built by Lenovo.

I don't doubt that for one split second, since late (second generation) A31p units were built in China, and they were pretty much done with by the end of 2003.

Having said that, my own *late* 2003 T40p was built in Mexico and is still running great (knock wood) within its (somewhat modified) specs...

They were building stuff in China prior to 2004, no doubt about that. But they've built next to nothing (or very little) outside of China after 2004...

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