Li-Ion Battery for ThinkPad

[edik]

I have just purchased from eBay a new (unused) battery for a T450, zero cycles apparently never connected to a machine.

It's the Li-Ion 68+ 6-Cell 72Wh (45N1134)... the ultra-long life for the T and X 440-470.

Although it hasn't arrived yet I am a bit concerned that the date of manufacture (according to the label on the eBay photo) was 2014-05, and I read after 2-3 years a Li-Ion battery is not that great....

Should I buy a battery with a recent manufacture date?I am just keeping my fingers crossed the battery will work ok?

No real experience with batteries as I just use them till they are not worthwhile any more... however this cost me around $70 USD so it's not cheap for me!

Thanks
Ed

[Thinkpad4by3]

Here is how Li-ions work:

When they are brand new, they will not go bad for about a decade before they even think to drop capacity. I found a 19+ battery from 2012 never used and it worked at 100% capacity. Got a brand new T61 and its battery held I believe like 90% and that was from '08.

When they are used past about 400 cycles(2-3 years), they will start significantly dropping in capacity depending on the manufacturer.

If a Li-ION battery is left COMPLETELY discharged(used) for a while, it will lose capacity like a stone. I had a phone that would last about 8 hours on a charge. I accidentally lost it for 3 weeks under the bed and it held a 30 minute charge if I was lucky.

If it is BRAND-NEW, it will be just fine.

[edik]

Many thanks for the information.

Hope all will be OK, it's a pity because I run Linux (Fedora 26) and it is not possible to view the battery cycle count under Linux unfortunately.

Given I am using the standard slimline 24Wh 4-Cell battery at the moment (around 2 hours usable) I will be happy with 3X that = 6 hours... + the internal battery (which gives me around an hour in Linux).

Problem with :Linux is even with "powertop" the battery consumes far faster than Windows.....

Ed

[axur-delmeria]

Is tlp available for Fedora?

[RealBlackStuff]

I have such a 68+ 6-cell from 2014-02
First used: 2014-04
Org./Now Capacity: 47.52/39.27 Wh (that is still 82.6%)
Cycles: 463
FRU: 45N1736
Made by LGC (Korea)

[edik]

Is tlp available for Fedora?

Yes and I use it! but unfortunately doesn't give battery cycles. Comes back with (after a tlp stat):

/sys/class/power_supply/BAT0/cycle_count = (not supported)

Same for BAT1...

I have such a 68+ 6-cell from 2014-02
First used: 2014-04
Org./Now Capacity: 47.52/39.27 Wh (that is still 82.6%)
Cycles: 463
FRU: 45N1736
Made by LGC (Korea)

Impressive. I just hope I can achieve the same. Didn't want to go with a 3rd party battery...

[Thinkpad4by3]

3rd party batteries always come with 3 parties.

The first one is when you recieve the battery after 2 months of waiting.

The second one is being surprised a 3rd party battery works fine.

The third battery is the one when it becomes a confetti cannon and blows itself to pieces and your laptop too.

[Cigarguy]

3rd party batteries always come with 3 parties.

The first one is when you recieve the battery after 2 months of waiting.

The second one is being surprised a 3rd party battery works fine.

The third battery is the one when it becomes a confetti cannon and blows itself to pieces and your laptop too.

I've used many 3rd party batteries and didn't have to wait 2 months nor had any blown up on me. A lot of 3rd party batteries came from a shipping address in the US so it was 2 weeks to Canada. All worked as expected. Most will only work for 2-3 years which is as I expected. More than a few have lasted and is still working after 5 years. For the price of a decent 3rd party battery I'm willing to tolerate this. I do use and abuse my laptops and battery. In the summer my laptop in a laptop backpack sits in my work truck with the summer car temps. In the winter it sits there all day in -20 to -30 deg C weather. None have blown up or committed a crime on me.

[edik]

I have no doubt there are good third part batteries with quality cells... but the problem is finding who these manufacturers are...

Many companies sell after market ThinkPad batteries but I found after looking at Amazon reviews (mostly useless as they are almost immediate) that searching the web that there is no real good source of what is a good make and what is a bad.

Also I found that the 72Wh 6-cells were rare.... many third-party 6-cells were 52Wh (and the lower capacity Lenovo T/X440-470 48Wh 6-cell) but finding a 72Wh 6-cell for the T450 other than a Lenovo one proved difficult... and when I did find one they were priced mostly around the same as an original!

Also I am in the UK... everything is double the price!

Bill should start up a ThinkPad battery sales page with "vetted" suppliers.. perhaps going all the way back to (if available) 700 compatible batteries... I'd buy from here as I'd feel comfortable that the community used them and they were reasonably OK.

EDIT:
Why am I still a "freshman" after 11 years?

[rkawakami]

OT

Why am I still a "freshman" after 11 years?

Forum ranking is based upon the number of posts that you have made, not by length of time you've been registered unfortunately. You'll be promoted in about 2.7 years at your current rate of posting (11 years / 4)

[edik]

Forum ranking is based upon the number of posts that you have made, not by length of time you've been registered unfortunately. You'll be promoted in about 2.7 years at your current rate of posting (11 years / 4)

Ahh thanks!


Anyway some news. I managed to put Windows 7 + Lenovo Power Manager on an external USB drive and boot my (LInux) T450 from it so i could view battery status.

BAT0 Internal has only 19 cycles and yet is at 83% of full capacity.. how did it lose 17% of its power??
BAT1 external (3-Cell 24Wh) has 153 cycles and still holds 94%

Not too unhappy though as my new 6-cell 72Wh coming will mean I rarely use the Internal battery... but still would have liked it to retain a but more energy.

I suspect that Lenovo Power Manager in Windows 7 handles battery charge levels much better than Linux Fedora 26... perhaps this has something to do with it.

[Thinkpad4by3]

Lithium batteries are not uniform, and can odd ones out can act strangely. I had a battery in my X230 that stored only 2/65Wh (3%) of its original capacity after only 120 cycles. Compared to my X220 battery with about 130 on it and it held 46wh(66%). Also, the little chip inside the battery is never 100% accurate. It could say it is 83% when it is like 90%. It happens, the chips are quite stupid.

[wujstefan]

Well I run 2 batteries on my T601f - both dated 2007 (so they're decade old now). 54Wh/56Wh from SONY after 195 cycles, and 68/78WH from PANASONIC after 577 cycles.
Not to mention my T43 battery that still holds almost a full charge.

So, let's say, their longevity varies

[Cigarguy]

Well I run 2 batteries on my T601f - both dated 2007 (so they're decade old now). 54Wh/56Wh from SONY after 195 cycles, and 68/78WH from PANASONIC after 577 cycles.
Not to mention my T43 battery that still holds almost a full charge.

So, let's say, their longevity varies

Hate saying this but batteries are not made to last like it did in those days. I have a few Panasonic cell batteries from those years that are going strong. Newer batteries are definitely designed with planned obsolete in mind.

[Thinkpad4by3]

+1 I got a Nintendo DS from 2004 (just because someone was throwing it out) and its battery with likely hundreds of cycles, was left in a drawer dead for 3 years and when recharged, it still held a 8 hour charge.

[edik]

Well arrived....


Inserted it into Laptop... not recognised by System or Lenovo Power Manager.... oh forgot to charge...

Plugged it into power block... started charging 0 cycles.... stated in Lenovo PM "This may take up to 10 hours to charge" however this soon changed and it charged in about 3.5hrs although leaving it overnight.

Interestingly the max capacity is 74Wh (for a battery rated as 72Wh) so its a little more charge than I expected!