Thinkpad Fan Noise Problem: Light at the End of the Tunnel

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#61 Post by **Shimodax** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 6:10 am

Btw, I tried it on my old T23 today. It did work (with that I assume that there's a good chance of the program working with most or all A, G, T, X, Z etc. models, just not the three digit models like 700, 760, etc.)

No wonder this machine was so quiet.

With bios mode the fan kicked in there at a max temp. of 66°C and blew 4850 RPM until it was back down to 45°C. With normal use I wasn't able to get it warmer than 52°C, only 100% CPU intense work did achieve the 66°C.

Markus

vpn-user · #62 Post by **vpn-user** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 6:13 am

Shimodax wrote:@VPN

Btw, what does the log window say about the fanbeep value? Does it reed it from the file correctly? Does it read other values from the file correctly? (E.g. if you change Cycle or temp. levels)?

[28.11.2005 23:13:05] Active= 1, Cycle= 5, FanBeep= 1200 30

Markus

All the other values seem to have effect. Only the beep values don' t work for me.

BTW I can set the FAN value to 64 and it WORKS (I have set it at 80°C and it really spins up higher than level 7). But there is something weird: If temperature get higher than 70°C, the fan fluctuates (Spins up and down speed all the time)! It does that even when controlled by BIOS (It already did that before I used your tool). Very strange.

#63 Post by **Shimodax** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 8:21 am

DIGITALgimpus wrote: This is exactly my point. This is why a real IBM fix is ultimately necessary. Because if you nuke your laptop, it's your problem. If IBM fixes it, and it causes problems, warranty covers that.

Seems that IBM was quicker than I thought:
http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=17784

I'm installing it at the moment ...

Markus

Zeitgeist · #64 Post by **Zeitgeist** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 8:30 am

Shimodax wrote:
Seems that IBM was quicker than I thought:
http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=17784

I'm installing it at the moment ...

....and?????? Problem solved?

#65 Post by **Shimodax** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 8:41 am

System still comes up after reboot with a fixed level of 7. After waking up from hibbernation it's auto bios. With auto fan still kicks for the 0xC1 at 43°C as before (CPU was 39°C, GPU 41°C).

I can't say if the pulsating fan noise is probably gone, too loud at the office here. The RPM meter in my latest version (will release that later today) may indicate a more stable fan speed, but I'm not sure.

Markus

JoeM · #66 Post by **JoeM** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 8:45 am

When running your programm on my T43P, I noticed a "passive" instead of your "active" textline in the status window. No NHC or simiilar is running at that point.

What did I miss?

Other than that it does seem to work quite well. I am not sure though on the lables given for the different temperatures. CPU is correct, the HDD temperature seems to be a bit high when compared to NHC.

emorphien · #67 Post by **emorphien** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 9:02 am

I'll have to try this later.

#68 Post by **Shimodax** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 9:08 am

New version.

Current Version: http://www.emtec.com/zzstuff/tpfancontrol_v012.zip
Previous Version: http://www.emtec.com/zzstuff/tpfancontrol_v011.zip
Previous Version: http://www.emtec.com/zzstuff/tpfancontrol_v010.zip

Source Code: http://www.emtec.com/zzstuff/tpfancontrolsource.zip (MS Visual Studio 6.0 project)

As always:

README.TXT updated in 2nd post of this thread (version changes, tested models, some adjustments etc.)

Please read the README.TXT before running the program for the first time. This is a bare bones tools with no bells or whistles (you'll need to modify the ini file to be able to access the function to turn chang the fan).

Also see the links section on the readme.txt for tech background.

If you want to discuss temperature settings, sensor locations etc. please use this thread: http://forum.thinkpads.com/viewtopic.php?t=17733

Questions, suggestions, and reports of successful tests on various untested models (see readme) should be posted here.

Enjoy

Markus

Thinkerer · #69 Post by **Thinkerer** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 9:08 am

Here the EC also reports 7 on register 0x2F after boot, but it doesn't really mean it -- it's in auto mode, and the the RPM is much lower than manual level 7.

My wild guess is that when you write to the EC register the value is latched and then used to change the EC's internal state; but on init, only the internal state is properly initialized, and the register contains nonsense.

#70 Post by **Shimodax** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 9:13 am

Joe,

the display as "Active" is new (I'm not sure if it already was in 0.11), but it's just a display issue, doesn't make a difference (Active=1, Passive= 0 and vice versa). Or please just download the 0.12 version.

Markus

#71 Post by **Shimodax** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 9:14 am

Thinkerer,

you're most likely right. In recent tests I had not noted it because the machine has hot enough to come up with the fan on and I didn't have RPM display. But I just started it cold and it says 7 on the 0x2F but the fan is off.

Markus

JoeM · #72 Post by **JoeM** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 9:28 am

Shimodax wrote:Joe,

the display as "Active" is new (I'm not sure if it already was in 0.11), but it's just a display issue, doesn't make a difference (Active=1, Passive= 0 and vice versa). Or please just download the 0.12 version.

Markus

Thanks for the quick reply. In that case I'll chose the easy way and just download the newest version.

Klaus.

angst · #73 Post by **angst** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 9:32 am

[29.11.2005 15:23:28] Can't read Status

what means this?

greets,

markus

(by the way, we're also talk about your tool at a german thinkpad forum. i just want to let you know.)

/edit: ok find out what is was... NHC (notebook hardware control). i disable it and now there is no more "cant read status" message.

#74 Post by **Shimodax** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 9:46 am

Angst,

possible collision with another tool that reads the embedded controller (see the README). I had encountered erratic results in the very first versions (not released), especially with NHC on so the newer versions read the whole set of values twice and compares the two and checks them for plausibility. If if fails you'll get the "Can't read status."

Glad to hear that the tool is helping many people (which forum is that)?

Markus

angst · #75 Post by **angst** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 10:05 am

http://thinkpad-forum.de/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3290

namenik · #76 Post by **namenik** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 10:06 am

There are two big boards in Germany:
http://thinkpad-forum.de/ (the sponsor is a shop, but we are free ... this is the board where are the most owner of new tps)
http://www.thinkpad-portal.com/ (server seems down

private, older models)

You can find the actual thread here: http://thinkpad-forum.de/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3290

and btw thx a lot

well ... sry, i don't need it - but i hope that we will get less frustrated posts about the noisy t43/r52 - or more threads because of the loud hds

DIGITALgimpus · #77 Post by **DIGITALgimpus** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 10:46 am

fwiw running with Embedded controller 1.04 (now says non-bios in fan
control):

[11/29/2005 10:41:09 AM] Current Config:
[11/29/2005 10:41:09 AM] Active= 0, Cycle= 5, FanBeep= 1200 30
[11/29/2005 10:41:09 AM] Levels= 48°C -> 0, 50°C -> 3, 55°C -> 4, 60°C -> 5, 70°C -> 7

So far pretty quiet! I'm excited, hopint it works.

CPU 43°C (0x78)
APS 43°C (0x79)
X7A 33°C (0x7A)
GPU 47°C (0x7B)
BAT 31°C (0x7C)
BAT 27°C (0x7E)
XC0 40°C (0xC0)
XC1 45°C (0xC1)
XC2 43°C (0xC2)

TimWang · #78 Post by **TimWang** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 10:53 am

Is it safe to run Fancontrol alongside NHC? I've seen a few people run them both at the same time and I tried it. It seemed to keep my temps. a little lower and I think volatge draw is lower too. It would be great to undervolt and have fan control in one package. BTW, thanks for a great fan control program

#79 Post by **Shimodax** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 11:03 am

DIGITALgimpus wrote:fwiw running with Embedded controller 1.04 (now says non-bios in fan control):

See a few posts back what Thinkerer had said.

So far pretty quiet! I'm excited, hopint it works.

CPU 43°C (0x78)
APS 43°C (0x79)
X7A 33°C (0x7A)
GPU 47°C (0x7B)
BAT 31°C (0x7C)
BAT 27°C (0x7E)
XC0 40°C (0xC0)
XC1 45°C (0xC1)
XC2 43°C (0xC2)

Pretty amazing ... I have never seen mine with C1 over 42°C and fan off (unless I turned if off, of course

).

Markus

#80 Post by **Shimodax** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 11:04 am

TimWang wrote:Is it safe to run Fancontrol alongside NHC? I've seen a few people run them both at the same time and I tried it. It seemed to keep my temps. a little lower and I think volatge draw is lower too. It would be great to undervolt and have fan control in one package. BTW, thanks for a great fan control program

Honestly, I don't know. But if you don't get too many "Can't read" message from Fan Control it's probably okay. (When I run NHC I get read errors constantly).

Markus

ruthlessbrad · #81 Post by **ruthlessbrad** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 11:12 am

When running the fan controller version 0.12 at the same time as NHC version 1.9 Beta 3, everything seems to work correctly, but I get a "Can't read Status" every 10 seconds on average. The fan controller also seems to respond much slower. After about an hour or two of this, the fan controller crashes.

The fan controller never crashes if I do not run NHC.

If I start NHC and then close it again while running the fan controller, I will get a few "Can't read Status" messages, but the fan controller will never crash.

Edit: T43 2668-75U

#82 Post by **Shimodax** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 11:19 am

@ruthlessbrad

Getting these errors every 10 seconds is not a good sign.

The crash may be caused by the fancontroller log overflowing (I'll look into that) but read errors that often are not good. It means that FC has a hard time reading the temp values. In this scenario I recommend to not use either of the two programs.

Markus

ruthlessbrad · #83 Post by **ruthlessbrad** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 11:33 am

Shimodax wrote:@ruthlessbrad

Getting these errors every 10 seconds is not a good sign.

The crash may be caused by the fancontroller log overflowing (I'll look into that) but read errors that often are not good. It means that FC has a hard time reading the temp values. In this scenario I recommend to not use either of the two programs.

Markus

Thanks for the recommendation, but FC seems to run flawlessly (no "Can't read Status" messages) when NHC is not running, so I'll take my chances.

This tool that you have created is simply too amazing to describe in words!!! The fan used to drive me CrAzY, but now the fan noise is at an extremely tolerable level. Thanks!

#84 Post by **Shimodax** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 11:38 am

ruthlessbrad wrote: Thanks for the recommendation, but FC seems to run flawlessly (no "Can't read Status" messages) when NHC is not running, so I'll take my chances.

I'll check the log regarding the crashes, the least thing you want is FC to crash when the fan is off. (It will remain off, no matter what).

This tool that you have created is simply too amazing to describe in words!!! The fan used to drive me CrAzY, but now the fan noise is at an extremely tolerable level. Thanks!

Many thanks! Without this tool I guess I would have sold my T43 already.

Markus

vpn-user · #85 Post by **vpn-user** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 11:54 am

In v0.12 my beep problem is solved. Thanks man!

Still have to manually select "smart mode", or are there already any command line switches available?

#86 Post by **Shimodax** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 12:00 pm

vpn-user wrote:Still have to manually select "smart mode", or are there already any command line switches available?

No, no undocumented features and no auto switch to smart (yet).

Markus

Zeitgeist · #87 Post by **Zeitgeist** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 12:02 pm

Sorry for my ignorance, but how can I set the .ini file to "active=1 "to allow program to modify
// fan.

?

NeoteriX · #88 Post by **NeoteriX** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 12:04 pm

Shimodax wrote:
DIGITALgimpus wrote: the only fix that IBM can issue (for existing units) is to increase the thresholds in the embedded controller firmware but this would make the laptop more likely to fry.
Well, playing a game or running a 3d renderer or fractal program will makes the laptop more likely to fry. I'm pretty sure with these you can easily achieve permanent termperatures of over 55°C with regular bios fan control.

Otoh my machine here, the way I use it, runls permanently lower than 55°C on all sensors with the fan off (in fact 46°C to 52°C).

Just food for thought.

Markus

Just some more thoughts--I'm not sure why people are so paranoid over system temps... I've been running Folding@Home in an attempt to do my part to hopefully find some cures to diseases, and so my laptop runs at like 60-70 degrees Celcius on a regular basis depending on ambient temps (w/ NHC, 100% processor, and BIOS fan control)... I can't imagine that a laptop wouldn't be designs to function as is at 100% processor load. I mean, the T4x/P are supposed to be workstations for 3D CAD and other workhorse functions. Any danger at these temperatures seems to me (from a non engineer standpoint) to be silly.

#89 Post by **Shimodax** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 12:07 pm

Zeitgeist wrote:Sorry for my ignorance, but how can I set the .ini file to "active=1 "to allow program to modify ?

As described in the Readme.

Right Click Fancontrol.ini, Open With, Notepad, change value, Save

Markus

DIGITALgimpus · #90 Post by **DIGITALgimpus** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 12:12 pm

After running a few hours with the new firmware, I don't think there is any real change. It sounds exactly the same as it did before at the same temps.

Thinkpad Fan Noise Problem: Light at the End of the Tunnel

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