T61 observations

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#1 Post by **RonS** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 2:26 pm

After some time on a 14"WS T61 w/Vista,

1. ClearType was NOT enabled out of the box. This, I believe, is a serious oversight on Lenovo's part. To turn it on, right-click the desktop and select "Personalize" then "Window Color and Appearance" then "Open classic appearance..." then "Effects" and finally select ClearType. The display is far more readable (IMO) when this is enabled.

2. The LCD quality (42X1671) is poor on my unit. I would not wish this display on anybody. You don't realize how bad it is until it's next to a decent screen like a Flexview or a Dell 2405.

3. When connected to the Advanced Dock, the unit does not engage securely. The front edge hovers off the desk. When docked, the integrated graphics chip does not support DVI.

4. The 7-cell battery sticks out 1/3" less on the T61 as the 9-cell does on the T60. It's exactly as wide.

5. My unit came with an integrated camera, but it doesn't show up as an active device anywhere until you download the T61 camera device software from Lenovo's driver matrix page. When the camera is on, a green LED lights up next to it to tell you it's on and you shouldn't do anything embarrasing. The image quality from the camera is very good - I'm pleasantly surprised by it.

6. The system gets VERY VERY hot when in the BIOS setup utility. Once Vista boots and power management kicks in, it's nice and cool, except that the right palm rest gets pretty warm (it's over the hard drive). I made the mistake of using the system on my legs (wearing shorts) while checking out the BIOS setup and I burned my leg. The system is also nicely quiet.

7. The Device Manager shows a "PCI Serial Port" and "PCI Simple Communications Controller" with yellow exclamation marks indicating that these devices need drivers. I'm surprised that the system shipped needing these drives -- I haven't tracked them down yet.

dsfinley · #2 Post by **dsfinley** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 2:44 pm

RonS wrote: 2. The LCD quality (42X1671) is poor on my unit. I would not wish this display on anybody. You don't realize how bad it is until it's next to a decent screen like a Flexview or a Dell 2405.

RonS, in what regard is the display quality lacking?

Per this thread, http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=138529 that's a Samsung display, fwiw.

egnatius · #3 Post by **egnatius** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 2:45 pm

RonS wrote:The system gets VERY VERY hot when in the BIOS setup utility. Once Vista boots and power management kicks in, it's nice and cool, except that the right palm rest gets pretty warm (it's over the hard drive). I made the mistake of using the system on my legs (wearing shorts) while checking out the BIOS setup and I burned my leg. The system is also nicely quiet.

Wow... and to think that Lenovo is marketing this model as one of the coolest-running Thinkpads yet.

pae77 · #4 Post by **pae77** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 4:01 pm

Interesting and helpful observations.

I don't think the fact that it runs hot while in the bios configuration mode would be much of a problem since normally one doesn't spend much time in there and that will probably be fixed by a future bios update.

Much more concerned about the display quality. I hope the 14" SXGA+ non wide screen, if it ever becomes available, will be at least as good as my T42p (which is not great either).

#5 Post by **Harryc** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 4:24 pm

That won't be fixed by any updates unless it is to the embedded controller program (to increase fan speed). When a machine is in BIOS, it typically approaches 100% CPU utilization because there is no power management (ACPI) active. If you were to boot into Vista or XP and ran the CPU at 100% utilization for an extended period of time you'd burn your lap, sure as sh_t.

packman · #6 Post by **packman** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 4:40 pm

Ron;

Could you please provide more information for Lenovo's driver matrix page, I have vista w/ ntegrated camera but unable to to find driver forit to use as as device.

dsfinley · #7 Post by **dsfinley** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 4:53 pm

pae77 wrote:Much more concerned about the display quality. I hope the 14" SXGA+ non wide screen, if it ever becomes available, will be at least as good as my T42p (which is not great either).

I just talked with a Lenovo sales person, who reiterated (a couple of other reps said the same to me, recently) that, no way, no how, will Lenovo be offering Thinkpad 14.1" standard screen versions to the general public, OSU non-withstanding.

He even suggested (I would want to verify this with the institutional sales force) that Lenovo will be withdrawing 14.1" standard screen versions from institutions that currently are able to offer them.

Has anyone ever gotten direct confirmation from Lenovo that they could offer 14.1" standard screen Thinkpads in the future?

chadwicktr · #8 Post by **chadwicktr** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 4:55 pm

I had a crappy Samsung WSXGA+ screen in a T60. Sounds like the WXGA+ Samsung panels are bad too. WHY does lenovo use this crap?

sokos · #9 Post by **sokos** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 5:04 pm

because it's T60 and not T60p?
No money, no honey?

But seriously, i m happy with my panel on the T61 even if it's not a flexview. It's wide and i just love wide now! i can run applications side by side, or when i do testing on new systems or Vm's i can have the VM or App using 3/4 of my screen and on the 1/4 i have the readme or manual PDF file. Wide rocks for people that need more than a window for their work.

Ghost · #10 Post by **Ghost** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 5:32 pm

reading all these reviews about T61 I have bad feeling:
- LCD quality often is bad
- Vista does not work flawlessly with both hardware and software in all cases (so it's better to replace it with XP?)
- other issues here and there...

Do you think it's too early to buy this model, or it's just like with any product - there are always "something"?

exlax · #11 Post by **exlax** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 5:36 pm

my LG lcd is just fine, and you can boost the brightness and contrast in the Nvidia utility if so desired.

sokos · #12 Post by **sokos** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 5:43 pm

Ghost wrote:reading all these reviews about T61 I have bad feeling:
- LCD quality often is bad
- Vista does not work flawlessly with both hardware and software in all cases (so it's better to replace it with XP?)
- other issues here and there...

Do you think it's too early to buy this model, or it's just like with any product - there are always "something"?

1. LCD is propably the best in the market. I doubt you ll find something better in the market at this price segment.

2. only software. Do what i did, get the vista model, make recovery CD's, install XP to do your work today and anytime tomorrow you can recover the Vista. Simple, cheap and win-win situation

3. Not any more issues than any other laptop.
You should see my previous Toshiba.. i m still laughing when i think about it

#13 Post by **RonS** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 6:06 pm

packman wrote:Ron;

Could you please provide more information for Lenovo's driver matrix page, I have vista w/ ntegrated camera but unable to to find driver forit to use as as device.

Here it is:
http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... MIGR-67853

Search the page for the word "Camera"

Redmumba · #14 Post by **Redmumba** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 7:02 pm

RonS wrote:After some time on a 14"WS T61 w/Vista,

6. The system gets VERY VERY hot when in the BIOS setup utility. Once Vista boots and power management kicks in, it's nice and cool, except that the right palm rest gets pretty warm (it's over the hard drive). I made the mistake of using the system on my legs (wearing shorts) while checking out the BIOS setup and I burned my leg. The system is also nicely quiet.

Funny... I have had exactly the opposite experience. Even out of the box, with SpeedStep enabled (but in XP) and no power-savings in effect, it never rose above a warmth--and it was far from uncomfortable.

1. LCD is propably the best in the market. I doubt you ll find something better in the market at this price segment.

Unfortunately, this isn't the case with the widescreen models... it sucks, but there it is. Viewing angles are miserable.

stallen · #15 Post by **stallen** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 7:15 pm

RonS wrote:
packman wrote:Ron;

Could you please provide more information for Lenovo's driver matrix page, I have vista w/ ntegrated camera but unable to to find driver forit to use as as device.
Here it is:
http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... MIGR-67853

Search the page for the word "Camera"

That doesn't say it's for Vista. That's what he is asking for.

Kenn · #16 Post by **Kenn** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 8:12 pm

Hey guys,

I just had my second run-in with the 14" T61 at a store, tried to pay a little more attention to the differences with my old T42.

Generally, I'm still OK with the WXGA+ screen. The resolution is adequate (I'm coming from UXGA Flexview), the screen is a smooth matte (like previous 14" thinkpads), and the brightness is just a tad below average compared to everything else around the shop.

The chassis has indeed grown. It's wider than my 15" (non-wide), about an inch shallower, and with lid closed exactly the same height. Weight is a bit heavier than I'd like for a thin'n'light, definitely more than a T42 14", and the display model had a 4-cell to boot, so I'm not sure what to think about that. I'd have hoped 3 years would allow Lenovo to come out with a lighter, rather than heavier design.

Again, the lid seems sturdy - tortional flex was at most as much as the old thinkpad's magnesium lid, and pressing down on center of the closed lid actually yielded less flex. Hinges are great, no flappiness like a Dell lid.

Also checked out an X60T, XGA resolution. Horrible sparkling on the screen, made everything look blurry. I had to double-check the native resolution as well as anti-aliasing settings, but I'm sure this has more to do with the capacitance layer for the tablet more than the LCD itself. I remember thinking the same thing when examining that old SXGA+ Toshiba tablet a few years ago. Now I really wish Lenovo would stuff a 12" SXGA+ superview screen into the X60s

I really do want to check out the Dell M1330. The things that would kill it for me would be if the keyboard was as crappy as the last-gen Inspirons and if the 13.3" screen had pixel gaps as large as the Sony SZ (same 1280x800 resolution, but my god that screen-door effect is awful).

#17 Post by **GomJabbar** » Mon Jul 09, 2007 8:46 pm

Enjoyed your observations, Kenn.

Dead1nside · #18 Post by **Dead1nside** » Tue Jul 10, 2007 12:30 am

Not liking any of this information on the screen quality. Hell I wouldn't mind a move to widescreen if they were decent.

#19 Post by **RonS** » Tue Jul 10, 2007 1:26 am

stallen wrote:
RonS wrote: Here it is:
http://www-307.ibm.com/pc/support/site. ... MIGR-67853

Search the page for the word "Camera"
That doesn't say it's for Vista. That's what he is asking for.

I used it in Vista (32-bit) and it worked just fine.

mailww · #20 Post by **mailww** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 1:26 pm

RonS wrote:
7. The Device Manager shows a "PCI Serial Port" and "PCI Simple Communications Controller" with yellow exclamation marks indicating that these devices need drivers. I'm surprised that the system shipped needing these drives -- I haven't tracked them down yet.

I encounter the same problems in my t61p.

Did you solve this problem and how?

thx

SHoTTa35 · #21 Post by **SHoTTa35** » Fri Aug 17, 2007 2:30 pm

PCI Simple Communications Controller - PCI Modem for sure.

PCI Serial Port - not so sure but where is i located? Check the device manager and it'll show you located on: xxxxxx

sahko · #22 Post by **sahko** » Wed Nov 19, 2008 9:58 am

SHoTTa35 wrote:PCI Simple Communications Controller - PCI Modem for sure.

PCI Serial Port - not so sure but where is i located? Check the device manager and it'll show you located on: xxxxxx

I know this thread is really old but in case someone is still wondering, those two are Intel AMT related. You need to enabled it from the BIOS to use it.

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