X60 or Sony SZ or Panasonic Y4 - bad experience with IBM :(

[dbeck83]

Hi, I sorta need some help as I need to buy a replacement for my broken T42. I have narrowed it down to 3 machines:

1) IBM Thinkpad X60 - 1.83 Dual Core - (17097HU) - I guess I don't need to elaborate...

2) Sony SZ premium - 1.83 Dual Core - carbon fibre casing - 128mb dedicated video memory and 128mb on board vram (nice feature!) - integrated webcam

3) Panasonic Toughbook Y4 - 1.6 ULV centrino - very light weight and long lasting battery life

The above are listed in terms of price from least expensive to the most pricey.

I used to have an IBM T42 23738ZH. It was a fantastic machine as I usually spend 10+ hours a day on it. I rarely used my desktop as I do all my work and gaming on the TP. However, recently, I dropped the laptop and broke the LCD monitor . I called the IBM tech support right away and I was really disappointed with the customer service I received. During the three hours phone call, I received misleading information and rude attitudes. First of all, the reps told me and confirmed many times that the machine would be fixed for free under warranty eventhough I told them in the first place that I dropped the machine. After a few more phone calls and a few call-backs, I found out that I'd have to pay for the repair of the machine since I didn't purchase an extended warranty when I got the laptop. I then called back and ask for the first rep who talked to me and she stated that I never told her I dropped my machine. Her rude attitdue triggered me to file a complaint and a few days later, I received a call from a customer relationship rep. She told me that she can offer me to purchase a replacement machine for a discount price of 5% off the retail price. I am a little disappointed in the small amount of discount ($95 bucks US) they are offering me...

Despite this, I am still considering another IBM machine since I really have no choice...they offer the best build quality and I know (from using my gf's laptop) that I will miss that little red trackpoint! I love the T series but then I don't want to get another one that looks 99% like my old computer. Also, I did find the T42 14" model a little bit heavy to haul around. That's why I am considering the X60. As for the Sony, I've heard a lot of bad comments about the build quality of these machine. I don't want to buy something that will break within 2 years. But the specs of the new Sony SZ premium are really attractive. Lightweight, bright screen, core dual and good video card (is it?). Finally, as for the Panasonic, I know that they have good build quality and are very light weight and have excellent battery life. However, I find them a little bit over priced and underperforming (1.6 ULV???). I have already kinda crossed this option out.

I really need some opinions from you guys! Please give me a hand! Thank you!

[nickpoore]

In my opinion the Thinkpads are the best build quality laptops out there.
I have seen too many Sony's just fall apart from too much use.

On my personal laptops, I always buy the "accidental damage" warranty - at $1000 to fix anything on a laptop, it just makes sense to spend the $300 on the warranty up front.
It is great knowing that whenever you have an issue, they are not going to try and pin it on you use of the laptop - it's just covered.
(I think they exclude fire & flood damage, but that's about it.)

(I just checked my order, and my laptop came with a 1 year basic warranty. It cost me under $300 to extend that to a 3 year warranty with full accidental damage support. Well worth it.)

Yeah, I know hindsight is 20/20, but buy another Thinkpad and get the warranty.

-=Nick=-

[pianowizard]

I would stay away from Sony. This poll shows that Sony got the lowest scores for reliability and customer satisfaction:

http://www.pcworld.com/reviews/article/ ... g,5,00.asp

Toughbooks are supposed to be about as well built as Thinkpads, though I have only used the latter.

[dbeck83]

I am so undecisive on the SOny, after seeing the picture, the laptop really does lock on my mind!! I really want to get it now and the laptop does have a better overall package. However, has anyone used any of the Asus laptops? Some people has suggested me to get an Asus W3J since it has the best graphics card in the small package available.

I just have a question for those of you with X41, is it comfortable to work on this machine with such a small screen? I really like the 14" of the T but I can't force myself to get another of the exact same machine! And I do love the weight of the X (around 3-4 pounds).

Thank you once again for all the help!

[hoya]

http://www.pcworld.com/reviews/article/ ... g,5,00.asp

that poll is from January 2005, which is seriously out of date.

if you pick up a copy of consumer reports, you will see that Sony consistently ranks as one of the most reliable brands. a quick visit to a Best Buy will allow you to see and feel the quality that Sony is famous for. their support has traditionally been horrendous, but it is getting much better. I have four VAIO's in my family (dating back to 2001) and so far they have been even more reliable than the ThinkPad. big surprise but true.

I saw the SZ premium at CES and really liked it, though the keyboard struck me as a bit strange so you will want to try it before plunking down $2500.

otherwise, I would go for the X60/s, especially if you're like me and can't live without the TrackPoint. Sony includes one on their BX and AX series, and Fujitsu includes one on the S7020 (S7000 series), but you wouldn't be happy with either one.

[dfumento]

Always get the three year depot warranty at least. It just comes to a few cents per day and also helps with the resale value of the unit if it is still under warranty.

[dbeck83]

The IBM rep doesn't seem to care if I don't choose their company again...so I guess I will just give Sony a try now. I am going to pick up the Sony SZ premium model! I will come back to IBM one day if they reminds to be IBM, not Lenovo (quality wise).

Thanks everyone for all the help.

Andrew

[bhtooefr]

Well, have fun with your Sony.

I personally have seen Sony's incredibly poor reliability with my own eyes.

Let's just say, see you in a few months

[dbeck83]

Apparently, the battery life of the Sony is...half what they stated due to an issue with dual core processor and USB 2.0 battery drain. Anyone know if the X60 is affected by this same issue? It would be helpful if anyone who got their X60 can comment on the battery life of the machine! Thanks

[hoya]

yes, the X60 also suffers from that issue. it is widely reported and Microsoft is working on a fix. it is actually a bug in XP SP2 which happens to cause a more pronounced drain on battery life on core duo processors.

[bhtooefr]

It affects all systems with the i945 chipset and Windows XP SP2. So, yes.

IIRC, it also somewhat affects single-core-only i915-based systems (like the T43 and X41). There was an article on it.

[ahrkron]

How's the sony behaving otherwise?

I'm in about the same position; although, I have to say, I'm more inclined toward the thinkpad.

Does the Sony have a CD writer?
Does it warm up near a hand rest?
What size/speed hard drive does it have?

[snife]

The thing is - most manufacturers systems looks and sometimes spec outclass the ThinkPad, but when you use them you realise that the systems seem to be less than the sum of their parts and servicability and support can be a pain in comparison to ThinkPads.

However, you mentioned yourself, the main reason I will stick with ThinkPads as long as they have them - the TrackPoint. Not having one slows me down more than any other specification of a machine could. I don't want a portable system which always has to be used with an external mouse so until the other manufacturers (and ignorant consumers) wise up to the fact that the TrackPoint is the only valid pointing method for notebooks then ThinkPads will have the edge for me.

The X60s are nice systems - personally I like the X60s and if I were in charge the main X60 would have been slightly larger with a built in optical bay to give a bit more distinction between the 2 models but its not up to me.

I would really consider about why you are considering other notebooks - spite is not a great purchasing reason (and I speak as a spiteful person generally) - sure you had a bad support experience but they are always certain idiots on the end of any telephone number; you dropped the machine so i'm sure you knew all along that you would have to pay for it - given that, a 5% discount is better than nothing.

[schmaud]

Hi,

check tom's harware guide for the battery life issue, I belive it only happens if you are using an USB2 device.

But be care full: also some internal features ( the web-cam?) might be USB2, not only the stuff you attach from outside.

Have fun with your Sony, remember,
I just couln't stand the screen and the missing track point...

cheers

ralf