Quadro NVS 140M VS Quadro FX570M 128MB

[jaobedoza]

i'm trying to educate myself about the different t61 hardware available i have a few questions about nvidia gpus offered on the t61 series.

for t61 4:3

t61 - Quadro NVS 140M 128MB
t61p - Quadro FX570M 128MB

is there a difference in performance here, both have 128MB.

for t61 widescreen

t61 - Quadro NVS 140M 128MB
t61p - Quadro FX570M 256MB

ok, why is the FX570M rated at 256MB in the widescreen models?

[jdrou]

570M should be significantly faster than the NVS 140M. Graphics memory amount is normally not nearly as important as the speed of the GPU itself and the speed/width of the memory bus.
See http://www.notebookcheck.net/Mobile-Gra ... 844.0.html

[jaobedoza]

ok, but why is the fx570m rated with 128MB and 256MB? is that possible?

[TuuS]

To answer your question "why" the increase in memory. These models were redesigned and done so with what was available at the time. When the widescreens were made it was at least a year after the initial design and memory was cheaper. More memory will mean more performance, but I can't tell you if this will translate into something you can see/feel when using the machine or not, but I'd say probably not.

[jaobedoza]

so lenovo put an additional 128MB memory on the later versions (widescreens) of the t61p?

i'm aware of the problematic nvidia gpus, but how exactly did it happened?

every nvidia 140m and fx570m chip manufactured from the start up to july 2008 were defective? or just a large batch of them?

i actually had a dell xps m1330 with an nvidia gpu(cant remember which one) that died last year because of overheating.

[RealBlackStuff]

All of them were faulty.
An inside layer in the GPU worked itself loose due to constant heating/cooling/heating/cooling.
If the machine has been on 24/7 it may not happen, but nobody now wants to run the risk...

[TuuS]

Actually a small number have failed due to internal separation of the lead substitutes used. No one knows for sure if all previous chips are faulty, or are likely to fail.

There is no doubt that all nVidia based T61 build prior to 08/08 should be considered as less reliable, but even years after this problem was discovered, the vast majority still work, so I'm not saying they are, or aren't defective, but there is no conclusive evidence that they all are.

What facts we do know is that most of the failed units were built before this problem was discovered (early 2008), the ones build in mid-2008 seem to have a substantially lower failure rate compared to earlier ones, so to sum it up, my opinions is any unit built prior to 08/08 should be considered less reliable, and any build prior to early 2008 should be considered much less reliable.

The nVidia GPUs used by other manufactures like your Dell actually have a much higher failure rate then Lenovo. I believe this is because the thinkpad cooling system is superior, but that is speculation.

Of course this is probably a matter of opinion, but I'd say its more accurate to say that any nVidia gpu installed in a T61 prior to 08/08 could potentially fail, but millions have been running for 4 years or more without issue, so I'd encourage you to draw your own conclusion.

[miro_gt]

mine has been running heavily overclocked for over 3.5 years, and I got my laptop in September 2007

just dont let it heat up past the 80 deg mark and all should be good In my case it does not reach temps past 75 deg, but I took special precautions for that to happen (thank for the existence of TPFanControl). Stock it would reach 86 deg or so when gaming, as I remember from long time ago, and that was even without overclock .. lol.

as for the models - 14" laptops came with 128MB memory and 64bit bus, while 15" and up were with double both.

my 128Mb GPU overclocked runs a bit faster that a stock FX with same memory, but if you overclock the FX then it would beat mine. Temps however go up for the second one and that might be the bigger problem.

[bighank]

Had a Nvidia 140M made in 08/08 replaced due to GPU failure. Very lightly used. Never for gaming.
Don't go by dates as my system should not fave failed if the new Nvidia board was in it.

[Raceboy]

I have two T61 NVS 140M boards that have A2 revision chips and both of them have failed with garbled video. These boards were not subject to overheating too.

I wish there was a 14.1 T61p board with V5200 or other video chip that does not desintegrate so I could put it to my T60p FlexView and have 8 GB RAM and T9500 or even X9000 CPU in there. Not to mention SATA II.

[TuuS]

@bighank, the improved nVidia chips are just that, improved, but it doesn't mean they will never fail. If the date on your laptop is 08/08, then it would be unusual for the actual chip to fail, but other areas of the graphics such as video ram, the solder connections, or related system board componants could fail too. The prior nVidia failures were related specifically to the "bump" material within the chip that cracked after extensive heating and cooling.

@Raceboy, I don't think there ever was a 4:3 board made with the updated nVidia chip. The numbers on the chip aren't an indicator of them being the redesigned chip, nvidia slipped the revisions in silently as to not draw attention. I'd also like to get a 4:3 board with some powerful graphics, but the only way to do that is to find a board that's been rechipped. I'm looking into getting some rechipped, if your failed boards are untouched, and no one has tried to do anything silly like reflow them in an oven, then they might be candidates to be rechipped.

Ideally, I'd prefer to get Lenovo remanufactured boards, but they aren't easy to come by.

[Raceboy]

These boards are still a "virgins", taken straight from the laptops.

[TuuS]

These boards are still a "virgins", taken straight from the laptops.

These are 14" 4:3 aspect?

If so, I'd consider getting them rechipped. I'll PM some information that is probably best not posted here.

[miro_gt]

I have two T61 NVS 140M boards that have A2 revision chips and both of them have failed with garbled video. These boards were not subject to overheating too.

I wish there was a 14.1 T61p board with V5200 or other video chip that does not desintegrate so I could put it to my T60p FlexView and have 8 GB RAM and T9500 or even X9000 CPU in there. Not to mention SATA II.

did you have the 256MB DDR3 version ?

mine is the small 128MB one, and my chip is also revision A2. Though working overclocked for long time, lol.

[TuuS]

The T61 was only available with the NVS140m chip with 128mb. The T61p had the FX570m chip with either 128mb (4:3 aspect ratio models) or 256mb (widescreen models).

Also note that the revision numbers and dates on the chips don't relate to them being the old less reliable, or new design. The new chips were introduced silently with the same numbers and can only be verified by a build date of 08/08 or newer on the laptop. Evidence also strongly suggests that the old and new design were manufactured concurrently, so it's highly probably that you could have a less reliable chip with a newer date code (on chip, not on laptop) then an updated chip. The only time that I'd consider the date on the actual chip to be significant is if you have a warranty board. If the GPU date is later then the end of the T61 production (2009 or newer), then it's obviously been rechipped. Just be careful though, there are facilities that are refurbishing these boards in 3rd world countries, and I suspect these boards may have undergone excessive stress from the heating process. I would expect their quality control is no where near that of Lenovo's, so if your considering buying one, I'd find one that offers a substantial warranty, not just the typical 30 days. I'd try to get a 1year warranty, if a repaired board lasts a year, then I'd say it will probably last a normal service life.