X1 vs. T430s

[Art Vandelay]

T430s vs. X1 Carbon

This isn’t so much a formal review as it is my random thoughts on two excellent laptop computers. I got my T430s in late July, and just received by X1 Carbon a couple of days ago. My T430s is a Core i5 running at 2.6 GHz with 8 GB RAM and a 128 GB SSD drive. My X1 Carbon has a 1.8 GHz Core i5 with 4 GB RAM and a 128 GB SSD drive. Both are running Windows 8 without any Lenovo crapware. Both processors feel equally quick running Windows 8, and I really don’t perceive any significant difference. Startup is lightning fast. Opening applications is the same on both. I’ll compare the two ThinkPads, and also make reference to the MacBook Air, which was the computer I owned before Windows 8 and the ThinkPad converted me.

SCREEN
The most immediately apparent difference between the T430s and the X1 is the screen. Both are 14 inch, 1600x900 screens, but the T430s looks physically larger. However, the X1 screen is much brighter and sharper than the screen on the T430s. The X1 is not an IPS display, but it is a much better quality twisted nematic display than the one Lenovo used on the T430s. The display quality is comparable to the MacBook Air, and may even be slightly superior to Apple’s choice of display. I’m not sure why Lenovo doesn’t choose the higher quality display across all of its ThinkPad models. ThinkPads are not $399 pieces of junk on the shelf at Best Buy, but Lenovo inexplicably cheaps out on some key components like displays. The screen is superior to the MacBook Air because it is both larger and with higher resolution, but actually feels and looks less bulky than the smaller 13” screen on the Air.

FORM FACTOR/BUILD QUALITY
The X1 Carbon is gorgeous to look at. The carbon fiber body is smooth but also has the subtle rubbery feel that the T430s only has on the lid. On both computers, I miss things like the caps lock light and the blue enter key, but the X1 Carbon feels extremely well made and high end. It is extremely thin and light, and compares favorably to the MacBook Air in this regard. The T430s has the more traditional ThinkPad look and feel. The T430s is built like a tank. Its extremely solid. Where the hinge on the X1 wobbles ever so slightly, the hinge on the T430s looks like it wouldn’t move if it were dropped off a building. It doesn’t have the smooth carbon fiber casing, but the plastic is solid and feels like high quality. The form factor of the T430s makes it more appropriate for work; the Ethernet port and VGA connector are still things I use for business. I’m going to use the X1 more for personal computing at home.

KEYBOARD & TRACKPAD
Lenovo obviously has taken some design cues from Apple. The smooth, clickable trackpad on the X1 is functional and comfortable to use. However, I prefer the trackpad with buttons that is found on the T430s. It is neither better nor worse, and this is a purely subjective preference. I also prefer the keyboard on the T430s. The thicker body of the laptop allows the keyboard to have slightly more depth, and slightly better feedback. However, the X1 keyboard is also excellent, and far superior to the keyboard on the MacBook Air.
BATTERY LIFE
I haven’t used the X1 Carbon enough to judge battery life, but the T430s has incredible battery life. I can go almost a whole day without having to plug it in. The battery on the X1 is probably a bit smaller, but I expect comparable performance for a battery of its size. I credit that to Windows 8’s excellent power management.

GENERAL IMPRESSIONS
The T430s is superior is some ways, but the X1 Carbon is just so [censored] cool it comes out on top. I’m going to enjoy using both. Both ThinkPads provide outstanding value for the money.

[Greg Gebhardt]

Glad to hear you are liking your X1C. I agree with you on most of the same points. I did miss the buttons at the trackpad at first but quickly adapted. I always use a wireless mouse when working at a table but the trackpad on the X1C is still the best with the most "predictable" response of any I have used. Even my W520 trackpad can not compare. I also like the way is is sightly lower than the surrounding palm rest as on the W520 they were level with each other.

[ZaZ]

While the X1 is the attention getter and a very good ultrabook, but I'd rather have the X230. One you get past the thinness, HD+ LCD and touch pad, which I never use, the X230 is a better machine in most ways

[Art Vandelay]

I think it all comes down to subjective preference. There is no "perfect" laptop. There are things that I love about the T430s and X1, but both involve compromise. I'm sure if I had an X230 sitting here, that would still be true. (I wish all ThinkPads had an IPS display, for example.)

The one good thing about Apple and Microsoft retail stores is that you get to compare before you buy. With ThinkPads, all you can do is read the specs, check out an online review, and hope for the best. I doubt we will see the full ThinkPad line in Microsoft stores any time soon, or Lenovo branded retail stores, but it would make finding the laptop that's perfect for you a bit easier.

[pianowizard]

With ThinkPads, all you can do is read the specs, check out an online review, and hope for the best.

Many brick-and-mortar stores do carry Thinkpads. Best Buy sometimes has a couple Thinkpad Edge models; Micro Center and Frys often have several "real" Thinkpads (T, W, X); and J&R Music World in NYC has many Thinkpads. This is much better than for Dell's and HP's business-class laptops, which are nowhere to be seen except for some universities' computer stores, and even at these stores we would typically see only 2 or 3 models on display.

I actually think that not having Thinkpads everywhere is helping Lenovo, because Thinkpads look worse in stores (when sitting side by side with other brands) than in photos on the internet. When seen in person, most of the widescreen Thinkpads look repulsive to me. In addition, when I to go a local store to feel and handle and touch laptops of different brands, Thinkpads actually don't compare favorably to other brands. I remember I once reported on this forum that at my former institution's computer store, an el cheapo Dell Inspiron actually felt far more robust than the T400 and T500 on display. So, I think Lenovo's best way to advertise Thinkpads is through the internet, not in brick-and-mortar stores.

[Greg Gebhardt]

While the X1 is the attention getter and a very good ultrabook, but I'd rather have the X230. One you get past the thinness, HD+ LCD and touch pad, which I never use, the X230 is a better machine in most ways

The thinness, HD+ LCD, touch pad AND keyboard are big pluses for me.

To each their own but the above is what sets the X1C apart from previous laptops.

[FragrantHead]

I actually think that not having Thinkpads everywhere is helping Lenovo, because Thinkpads look worse in stores ... an el cheapo Dell Inspiron actually felt far more robust than the T400 and T500 on display.

And so the truth comes out! Don't get me wrong. I'm a die-hard Thinkpad user, but my parents had an Inspiron 1000 and that thing felt solid like a brick, especially the palm rests.

I think with any laptop design that includes low weight as a priority, the engineers tend to push it to the limit of where it gets compromised. The only question is how far. When a machine touts the use of carbon fibre, titanium or other exotic materials, you know weight was a concern and it's liable to be merely as solid as the competition in the final analysis. Just a tad lighter. I hear the Lenovo salesmen praising the X1Cs use of carbon fibre on YouTube only to see the screen twist as they open it.

Disclaimer: I have no access to an X1C. For all I know it could be really solid and my impression is wrong. I am only trying to convey a general point, which is that I agree Thinkpads, these days and on the whole*, don't feel as well made as some other designs, notably either cheap machines that pay no heed to weight or the aluminium unibody designs from certain competitors.

* Let me narrow that down, I can, in truth, only speak to the T20, T30 and T410s I have owned. I'll probably make an exception for the X220 I got recently, which feels really solid and not creaky. It's only when you take it apart to fit a WiFi module that the palm rests feel quite fragile in their disassembled state.

[pianowizard]

I think with any laptop design that includes low weight as a priority, the engineers tend to push it to the limit of where it gets compromised. The only question is how far. When a machine touts the use of carbon fibre, titanium or other exotic materials, you know weight was a concern and it's liable to be merely as solid as the competition in the final analysis. Just a tad lighter. I hear the Lenovo salesmen praising the X1Cs use of carbon fibre on YouTube only to see the screen twist as they open it.

Excellent analysis! I totally agree. I just acquired a Sony X Series which is an extreme example of the compromise that needs to be made. I believe it's the world's lightest laptop ever, at only 1.41 lbs (640 grams!). It uses the best material available but because Sony wanted to make it the lightest laptop ever, an unprecedented amount of compromises were made, resulting in a stunningly fragile product. It's still very useful for me though because I do want to travel as light as possible and this nearly weightless machine is perfect.

P.S. I believe that for the Sony X Series, the widely circulated weight of 1.60 lbs applies only to the 128GB SSD models. 64GB SSD models, like the one I have, weigh only 1.4 lbs.

[ThinkRob]

. I hear the Lenovo salesmen praising the X1Cs use of carbon fibre on YouTube only to see the screen twist as they open it.

Flexible != fragile.

Let me narrow that down, I can, in truth, only speak to the T20, T30 and T410s I have owned. I'll probably make an exception for the X220 I got recently, which feels really solid and not creaky. It's only when you take it apart to fit a WiFi module that the palm rests feel quite fragile in their disassembled state.

Individually, most of the parts in a laptop are relatively fragile. Like any complex machine, the strength of the assembled product can (and often is) more than just the sum of the individual parts.

[pianowizard]

Flexible != fragile.

Does this statement apply to non-Thinkpads as well?

[Art Vandelay]

I wouldn't call the X1 Carbon "fragile", but there is a slight screen wobble, where my T430s is solid as a tank. Still nothing I'd get too excited about, though. The X1C is at least as rigid in the body as a MacBook Air, if not more so. Its a very high quality build, but to get it thin and light they had to make sacrifices.

[ThinkRob]

Does this statement apply to non-Thinkpads as well?

Why wouldn't it?

It applies to airplane wings too, as anybody with a over-wing window seat can attest to...

Flexibility is (sometimes) good. Permanent deformation or internal component damage, not so much.

[pianowizard]

Why wouldn't it?

Good to confirm that, because what I often hear is that when a non-Thinkpad laptop has flexible parts, that means they MUST be fragile.

[ThinkRob]

Good to confirm that, because what I often hear is that when a non-Thinkpad laptop has flexible parts, that means they MUST be fragile.

It depends on the part and the materials. In general I do think that flexible metal on a laptop is a bit more worrisome than flexible plastic -- if that's what you're getting at -- since my experience is that while plastic tends to return to its original form, metal can and will warp. Then again, plastic tends to fracture when flexed enough, so it's not always a clear win.

Personally I am more concerned about flex in some areas than others. Screen lids used to be of great concern to me, as I've dealt with a number of laptops that have had damaged backlights, etc. due to lid flex. LED screens have gone a long way towards avoiding that issue, and lid flex is no longer the cause for concern for me that it once was.

Keyboard flex has nothing to do with fragility or the fear thereof (at least not for me.) The only reason I dislike it is that I think it sucks to type on.

IMHO a bit of case flex is generally a good thing, provided that the planar is not subjected to much flex. I want the outer casing of my laptop to have some give to it, so that when I drop it on a corner of a table I don't put a visible dent in the casing (something which I've accidentally done in the past.) On the other hand, I don't want a repeat of the T4x's issues. This is the reason why I tend to think that Apple and Dell's approach of strong external casings doesn't work as well as Lenovo's (and others?) frame + plastic approach; while I certainly will agree that Dell's design feels much higher quality, my experience is that latter survives slightly better.

If you want a real torture test, open a laptop as far as it can go, and hold it out like you're handing a piece of paper to somebody, gripping it by the top edge of the lid. Apple's machines survive this by being light and metal. Dell's business machines survive this by being metal and very rigid. ThinkPads survive this by having flexible, strong CFRP lids. Three different approaches, all work well.

So as is often the case in computing, the answer is: it depends.

[DTNF130L]

I know this forum is about the X1C - Carbon versus the T430S, but I'm curious what you experts on this board think of the original X1 versus a T430S?

The X1C is out of my price range, but I can get a new X1 or T430S for about the same price, hence the comparison. My number one concern is weight; On paper it looks like both are about the same weight but I know that can be deceiving.

The T430S has more features (bigger screen, better resolution, Bluetooth 4.0, lightening fast connect time, DVD) and I worry that the X1's gorilla glass will have too much glare. Practical me says I won't notice a few ounces and should go for the T430S. But I really, really want the X1 if it is truly lighter and better looking.

For context, I currently use a T420I (4177 CTO) and find it too heavy to travel with. I miss my old 570E which I found to be the perfect size and weight back in the day. My work-issued X201 is too small (screen wise).

Thanks for any thoughts/advice!