Under construction: R61p *Picture warning*

[wujstefan]

Hello there,

I've been under great impression of work that was made by guys ofer here and there:
viewtopic.php?f=29&t=110323
/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=109360

Those guys did it. 14,1" and 15" 4:3 T601s with fx570m 256mb. Wow.
My turn. Project under construction: T61p motherboard inside R61i 4:3 chassis.

1. Why R61? Because R61 is very close construction-and-rigidity wise to A31p that I personally love. Left handside ports fit perfectly. LCD cable is the same, and in the same place. I have an option of Hydis screen installed and a touchpad-free palmrest. Cooling should be better as it is thicker and provides more space.
2. What have been already done? I have already modded the frame to accomodate the board and modded the heatsink to fit properly. Am very happy with the outcome, as the frame did not loose rigidity at all. I need to test the heatsink, as it has lost some lamellas in the process.
3. What are the future plans? Hydis led screen installed. FSB-mod along with QX9300 or - if this comes too hot - P9700 for good clocks and low heat.
4. What are the drawbacks? It loses firewire (oh no!) and ultrabay. However, I will try to fit a UB 3-cell battery in this place. Ultrabay in R61 provides more space, so I might be successfull with that. I am losing exactly one (1) installation point on the mobo. Everything else seem to work so far.

Now what's the hassle? Why do I bother with system that old? T61 is still snappy enough to take care of everyday tasks. Its GPU options are poor, however. So I decided to go an inconvenient way, and get something that will suit me nicely. Fx570m 256Mb is FAR superior to any other option, power-wise, and it will work perfectly for all my 4:3 retro gaming ^^

Pictures will follow. I need to get all the missing stuff first

[atagunov]

Hello sir, apologies for not being versed enough in R61 family

- is this a 14" or 15" 4:3 you're building?
- which T61p motherboard did you pick up?
- that Hydis led - is it a new purchase or something you've had for years? diy-led or "ex-factory"? what resolution?

Good luck with your project!

[unixed]

Your link to the 15.0" T60(T61p) has the 128MB vRAM FX 570M, not the 256MB version. There is a big difference in difficulty, especially if you retain full ultrabay functionality.

[wujstefan]

- is this a 14" or 15" 4:3 you're building?

15" 4:3

- which T61p motherboard did you pick up?

FRU 42w7877 - Penryn-native T61p 16:10 15,4" w/fx570m

- that Hydis led - is it a new purchase or something you've had for years? diy-led or "ex-factory"? what resolution?

I have one last spare, but I will order a couple more just to have some when in need. These are 15" UXGA LED ex-factory, as described on TheBoardRoom by RealBlackStuff and ajkula66.

[wujstefan]

Your link to the 15.0" T60(T61p) has the 128MB vRAM FX 570M, not the 256MB version. There is a big difference in difficulty, especially if you retain full ultrabay functionality.

AFAIR this also was a 256mb unit. 128mb fx570m mod is a piece of cake, albeit pointless to my taste.

[atagunov]

- is this a 14" or 15" 4:3 you're building?

15" 4:3

Thumbs up! So you think R61i body is preferable to T60?.. Stronger, thicker but otherwise similar?.. Hmm..

- which T61p motherboard did you pick up?

FRU 42w7877 - Penryn-native T61p 16:10 15,4" w/fx570m

Did you manage to find some with a new nVidia? I've been looking for them recently.. Somebody outbid me on ebay.de last Sat at EUR 84. I used a wrong ebay tactics - I posted my bid a week ahead of auction completion.. hoping to push others who didn't care about date that much into buying other T61-s.. but this tactics backfired on me . It opened my cards to somebody else keen on post 08/08 machine. I also thought I had another auction coming to completion on Sunday as a backup so didn't fight too much. Too bad that the guy selling his T61 on Sunday had confused MTM. His T61 was indeed post 08/08. But it wasn't an nVidia one I only found that out once the auction for 15.4" 08/10 nVidia one had completed. Yet again coming closer to EUR 100 inclusive of delivery is already similar to TuuS-s price - seems he hasn't run out entirely still of the last remaining boxes. Yeah that T61 sold for EUR 84 also included a dock - which has now cost me £15 delivered - and a 2nd charger which I don't need..

I myself now feel sort of put off by 15.4 mobos.. I've started to think this will be a good machine for watching old DVD-s and so keeping ultrabay and DVD are worthwhile. Plus they still sell 30Wh batteries on ebay that go into that ultrabay.. Having a 2nd batt wouldn't be bad.. Another reason to go for a 14.1 4:3 mobo. I guess I'm learning towards them now.. I'm not going to game much so weaker GPU won't be a prob, but I don't want to go Intel either because then I won't be able to overclock RAM

- that Hydis led - is it a new purchase or something you've had for years? diy-led or "ex-factory"? what resolution?

I have one last spare, but I will order a couple more just to have some when in need. These are 15" UXGA LED ex-factory, as described on TheBoardRoom by RealBlackStuff and ajkula66.

Would you mind sharing where you buy from and how good the quality is? We know where Natakrana got a new CCFL on AliExpress for around $70 + $15 inclusive of delivery but I don't know where to reliably get decent quality 1600*1200 Hydis panels with ex-factory LED-s

[unixed]

No, it clearly uses the 14.1" T61p planar which has the 128MB vRAM FX 570M. The mod process is no different from that of the common T601. The 256MB vRAM GPU mod is a different kettle of fish.

[wujstefan]

Thumbs up! So you think R61i body is preferable to T60?.. Stronger, thicker but otherwise similar?.. Hmm..

Definitely stronger. Better hinges. Thicker. Heavyier. Scratch-resistant lid. And so on

Did you manage to find some with a new nVidia?

Some time ago, yes. Exactly one, dated 28week 11 year afair. I was feeling like winning the lottery. I do not mind about this anymore though, I'd rather buy 3 from 07 than 1 from 09.

I myself now feel sort of put off by 15.4 mobos.. I've started to think this will be a good machine for watching old DVD-s and so keeping ultrabay and DVD are worthwhile. Plus they still sell 30Wh batteries on ebay that go into that ultrabay.. Having a 2nd batt wouldn't be bad.. Another reason to go for a 14.1 4:3 mobo. I guess I'm learning towards them now.. I'm not going to game much so weaker GPU won't be a prob, but I don't want to go Intel either because then I won't be able to overclock RAM

I still have couple of unused, NOS and genuine 3-cell ultrabay batteries if you like.
You don't need to overclock RAM in intel unit. This is only an option - with FSB-mod (allows using 1066FSB CPUs, including X9100 or even QX9300 after further BIOS-mod) you need to change RAM SPD, but... well, try to search the forum. This is to be done yet

Would you mind sharing where you buy from and how good the quality is? We know where Natakrana got a new CCFL on AliExpress for around $70 + $15 inclusive of delivery but I don't know where to reliably get decent quality 1600*1200 Hydis panels with ex-factory LED-s

Well I had my source in the US (new, unused panels), but I need to get a feedback first if he still has them! You can PM me, if you want to get some I can order them for you as well. They require cable and inverter mod - but I guess this is obvious

No, it clearly uses the 14.1" T61p planar which has the 128MB vRAM FX 570M. The mod process is no different from that of the common T601. The 256MB vRAM GPU mod is a different kettle of fish.

Definitely. The hardest part of T601 w/128mb fx570m frankenpadding is sourcing the board. For 256mb, it is the easiest part.

[atagunov]

You don't need to overclock RAM in intel unit. This is only an option

I actually actively want to overclock RAM. My goal is to squeeze every last % of the CPU score, just for the sport of it I think I understand the process of doing so

Definitely. The hardest part of T601 w/128mb fx570m frankenpadding is sourcing the board. For 256mb, it is the easiest part.

Errhh.. I guess you're saying that it's difficult to find a 14.1 4:3 fx570m board but you have to cut very little magnesium from the chassis. In contrast you're saying that it's easy to get a 15.4 fx570m board with 256mb but you have to dremel more? And also mess with placing the SSD in ultrabay?

Sourcing a new nVidia seems quite impossible either way these days. Except for TuuS Indeed there are a lot more 15.4 machines around many of them with nVidia.. some probably with 256Mb. But I've seen only one >= 08/08. That one was nvs140m and it went for EUR 84 with dock in Germany - because my top bid was EUR 83.

I read somewhere that with moderate overclocking nvs140m may catch up to fx570m 128Mb.. heh but then with these being pre-08/08 you probably don't want to overclock that much.. I certainly see the appeal of 256Mb version but then if I have decided ultrabay takes priority I probably have to scratch that..

[wujstefan]

Errhh.. I guess you're saying that it's difficult to find a 14.1 4:3 fx570m board but you have to cut very little magnesium from the chassis. In contrast you're saying that it's easy to get a 15.4 fx570m board with 256mb but you have to dremel more? And also mess with placing the SSD in ultrabay?

Nope. Both boards are hard to get. Putting 128Mb unit it into T60 is simply piece of cake; almost a drop-in replacement. Why place SSD into ultrabay? I'd rather use up ultrabay space for UB 3-cell battery, and for SSD I'd go with 1/2 SATA-to-mSATA adapter (just as I did in my R600).

I read somewhere that with moderate overclocking nvs140m may catch up to fx570m 128Mb.. heh but then with these being pre-08/08 you probably don't want to overclock that much.. I certainly see the appeal of 256Mb version but then if I have decided ultrabay takes priority I probably have to scratch that..

Not this way - overclocking is not overvolting. With no extra voltage you'd like to overclock as far as it goes and stays stable.
From my tests that I have published here on the forum couple of years ago, 256mb fx570m is far superior to 128mb unit, and still allows for overclocking. 128mb unit does not. nvs140m does overclock getting very close to fx570m while eating 10W of power only, compared to a whopping 35W that the fx consumes.

[unixed]

The problem with the 14.1" T61p is that I've yet to see a post 08/08 manufactured machine, I don't think any were produced. I have once seen a photo of a planar with a post 08/08 GPU, but that's it.
The correspondingly dated 15.4" machines and planars, while still rare, are obtainable. So reliability, in particular that related to the NVIDIA GPU, is the issue. As usual.

The 15.0" R61(i) isn't noticably thicker where it counts -- the keyboard appears to be at the same height as that of a T61, although I'm not using a micrometer. I frequently run them side by side. The thickness seems to due to the lid. Definitely the height differences of the drives (9.5mm versus 12.7mm IIRC) used in the ultrabay slim (T61) and ultrabay enhanced (R61) adapters is not due to the base thickness difference.

[atagunov]

Nope. Both boards are hard to get. Putting 128Mb unit it into T60 is simply piece of cake; almost a drop-in replacement.

I'm really sorry for taking everybody's time.. but why is 128Mb easy and 256Mb difficult? I would understand why 14.1" 4:3 T61 mobo is easy and 15.4" T61 mobo is difficult. But why is 256Mb on a 15.4" more difficult than 128Mb on a 15.4"?..

Why place SSD into ultrabay? I'd rather use up ultrabay space for UB 3-cell battery, and for SSD I'd go with 1/2 SATA-to-mSATA adapter (just as I did in my R600)

I was under impression that if you put a 15.4" T61 mobo into either 14" or 15" 4:3 T60 you wouldn't be able to use ultrabay at all. You wouldn't be able to put a DVD drive there. You wouldn't be able to put a battery there. Was I wrong?

Re SSD I was planning to take BX500 out of its casing and attach it directly; it should fit since it's so small. Then there is concern that BX500 might be a lot slower than Samsung EVO 860 even on SATA II due its vastly inferior random 4k IOPS.. so I am hesitant about BX500.. I paid £50 for this BX500 when I was planning to use a 15.4" board. Now I "pivoted" my plan towards a 14.1" board so that I can use the ultrabay normally. Samsung will cost another £75.. I'm now hesitant which drive to use

nvs140m does overclock getting very close to fx570m while eating 10W of power only, compared to a whopping 35W that the fx consumes.

I expect to mostly use the Thinkpad in applications that don't require 3d abilities of the graphics card. I would like to have as long battery life as possible instead. I guess because nvs140m can be had on 14.1 4:3 boards and 256Mb fx570m cannot I will probably go for nvs140m.. It'd be nice to have extra 3d power for those unexpected occasions when I might fire it up. But that's very low on my list of priorities..

[wujstefan]

The problem with the 14.1" T61p is that I've yet to see a post 08/08 manufactured machine, I don't think any were produced. I have once seen a photo of a planar with a post 08/08 GPU, but that's it.

I had two of such boards. They do exist

The 15.0" R61(i) isn't noticably thicker where it counts -- the keyboard appears to be at the same height as that of a T61, although I'm not using a micrometer.

I will measure it, but the base is actually thicker - and the extra place is UNDER the motherboard. This s very visible when you install the heatsink - I will share the photos later on; there are ~4mm of extra space, and that's a great lot for this thinkpad. Especially that you need to nerf the heatsink a bit to make it fit (and cutting/welding copper is not very simple really). What actually shocked me was the port distribution (almost the same fo 15,4" T61 and 4:3 R61!), mostly the same mounting points position, the same spill point position, the same LCD cable position...). I'm working on applying stable pressure on the GPU to keep the heatsink properly pressed on the chip, as the space around the GPU is almost the same.

I'm really sorry for taking everybody's time.. but why is 128Mb easy and 256Mb difficult? I would understand why 14.1" 4:3 T61 mobo is easy and 15.4" T61 mobo is difficult. But why is 256Mb on a 15.4" more difficult than 128Mb on a 15.4"?..

Well that is very simple! There were no 15,4" boards with 128Mb fx570m graphics We could divide it this way: fitting 14,1 4:3 T61 mobo is easy, 15,4" 16:10 T61 256mb fx570m mobo is difficult, 15,4" 16:10 T61 128mb nvs140m/intel mobo is pointless, as you can have all the same from better fitting 14,1" unit

I was under impression that if you put a 15.4" T61 mobo into either 14" or 15" 4:3 T60 you wouldn't be able to use ultrabay at all. You wouldn't be able to put a DVD drive there. You wouldn't be able to put a battery there. Was I wrong?

UB is still operational, and if you do not mind that something is sticking out ~2cm on the right handside of the system, it is swappable as well. I was planning to fit the UB battery flush, and I guess this is possible. Using second SSD in that place is no problem as well, as long as you do some tinkering.

[atagunov]

UB is still operational, and if you do not mind that something is sticking out ~2cm on the right handside of the system, it is swappable as well

...so a non-swappable DVD could sit flush without sticking 2cm with a 15.4 T61 board in a 15" or 14" 4:3 T60/R60/R61?
To my taste devices sticking out is not aesthetically right.. and not worth the extra 3d FPS..

15,4" 16:10 T61 128mb nvs140m/intel mobo is pointless, as you can have all the same from better fitting 14,1" unit

Chances of finding >= 08/08 nVidia 15.4 T61 seem a little higher than a 14.1 4:3. There was one last week on ebay.de. If one is lucky enough to get such a board for reasonable money than it would make sense to use it even if 128mb nvs140m.. Otherwise yes you're certainly right

Especially that you need to nerf the heatsink a bit to make it fit (and cutting/welding copper is not very simple really)

I certainly hoped that cutting away metal with a dremel from W500 cooling assembly would be enough to fit it into a T60 Frankenpad. I hoped there'd be no keyboard bulge either. Welding? Can't do..
Now thanks to your explanation I wouldn't mind a 15" 4:3 R60/R61 body either. But I already got this T60 so it kind of makes sense to use it

[unixed]

The thing is that you can't tell one from another when you type on it in terms of base thickness. I wouldn't want to discourage anyone from getting an R61(i) because they thought they would have to adjust their typing due to a "thicker" base. As said, I've typed on them side by side for an extensive time and the observation is from that perspective. Internally it is a different matter and helps decide which of the 15.0" R and T series to use.

[wujstefan]

Keyboard is the same. Generally I have a new toy for the weekend.



https://imgur.com/a/DXXviv3

[dr_st]

Gotta love those Frankenpads and the R61 15" is such a special thing. There may be one in my future, especially if the T60 bites the dust; if I find a good unit, may settle for just replacing the screen with an IPS, leaving the base intact (although it means Intel GPU).

[ajkula66]

I'm in love with this project of yours, my friend...

[unixed]

Good work. The keyboard retention screw doesn't pass through the planar and requires a better solution than omission to preserve the famed keyboard response characteristics, but you're well on your way.

[wujstefan]

Good work. The keyboard retention screw doesn't pass through the planar and requires a better solution than omission to preserve the famed keyboard response characteristics, but you're well on your way.

Fixed with... double-sided 3M tape ^^' Generally the same occurs for R600

Gotta love those Frankenpads and the R61 15" is such a special thing. There may be one in my future, especially if the T60 bites the dust; if I find a good unit, may settle for just replacing the screen with an IPS, leaving the base intact (although it means Intel GPU).

Take a glimpse at eastern europe market. They are getting really hard to get, but still available here.

[dr_st]

Take a glimpse at eastern europe market. They are getting really hard to get, but still available here.

Is there a local eBay that you recommend or otherwise an online trading platform that's easy to use internationally?

[wujstefan]

@dr_st - see PM
@everybody - thank you for your kind words - this is what actually drives me enthusiastic about the project

As for the rest, I will definitely need to work around cooling solution. Tops at 84C (GPU), and seems too much. I will post some instructions when I'm done. This is a VERY easy mod. I was not expecting this to be that easy.

EDIT: looking for someone willing to take some part in this project - I need an adept help in battery rebuilding the ultrabay is shorter, but it is 12,7mm - real UB size is 12,9mm, and cavity size is 14mm, so lots of spare space. Cell height is... 6mm, what makes me believe, that it is feasible to put one cell on another. I have no skills and tools needed for battery rebuilding, and so would like to ask for community help. I have an idea of how to accomodate the battery and KEEP THE ULTRABAY SWAPPABLE. I will design and reconstruct the plastic part on 3D printer, but need someone to put one cell on another, rotate the PCB 90 degrees and remake the battery cable. I have a working 3-cell ultrabay battery and am missing... mostly the skill

[Natakranta]

Nice job More pictures from inside if you made any in the process please.
And how's the 256MB graphics performing? Really so much better than NVS140M or FX570M in poor mans 128MB version?
One test please. Can it play smoothly 1080p in 60fps on YouTube? I know 30fps is no problem even for NVS140M, but how it handles 60fps videos?

But look! Some gremlins stole touchpad from from your laptop! They covered the hole so nice nobody noticed
OK, I know, some just turn it off or replace with padless palmrest if available, but I can't imagine living only with The Nipple

[wujstefan]

And how's the 256MB graphics performing? Really so much better than NVS140M or FX570M in poor mans 128MB version?
One test please. Can it play smoothly 1080p in 60fps on YouTube? I know 30fps is no problem even for NVS140M, but how it handles 60fps videos?

Will check that after I'm done with software on this system From my previous tests with those systems (you can find them in T6x section): 256Mb fx570m is HUGELY better than both 128Mb chips.

But look! Some gremlins stole touchpad from from your laptop! They covered the hole so nice nobody noticed
OK, I know, some just turn it off or replace with padless palmrest if available, but I can't imagine living only with The Nipple

I told them to take it and go away Just to make it clear: this was my intention. There is no problem installing a touchpad-equipped palmrest version.

[wujstefan]

One test please. Can it play smoothly 1080p in 60fps on YouTube? I know 30fps is no problem even for NVS140M, but how it handles 60fps videos?

Without any issue.

All in all I have tested the device, and it works like a charm. The temperatures are somewhat high with T9300 and definitely need some tweak (Idle 45C on CPU and 57C on GPU - load 82C on CPU and 84C at GPU). On the other hand, GPU accepted an overclock with no voltage increase - 620MHz on core (up from 475MHz) and 915MHz on RAM (up from 750MHz), which resulted in a whopping performance increase in both real-life and benchmark tests. 3dmark06 jumped from 3537 points up to 4520 points, so more than 25%. Framerate on Civ 5 increased from 42fps up to 55+ fps on medium settings. Solidworks 2015 same part render dropped from 2mins 48sec to 1min 55sec. That's a lot of juice from such an old thingy!

[Natakranta]

Good news, great performance.
I wonder if overclocked NVS140M can play smoothly YouTube 1080p at 60fps.
I guess I'll know when I do my T601 Frank, but for next two weeks I must concentrate on my exams (all online, my 3 monitors command center is managed by my W541 )

[wujstefan]

Been fightin' the temps on this thing and... to no avail. This thing seemingly just have to run hot unless some extra mods are performed.

This is, I will ofc work on it all the way down.

I wonder if tpfancontrol produces reliable values for those temps. I see 60C on CPU (HWinfo) and 69C (TPFancontrol). Same for GPU, but otherwise - 66C (HWinfo) and 58C (TPFancontrol).

[RealBlackStuff]

Try Core Temp for more accurate info: https://www.alcpu.com/CoreTemp/

[Raphael_Walt]

Hello. New member here. I decided to come here because a friend "donated" (more like he left it permanently in my bookcase lol) his old, XGA-screen resolution, 2GB ram, R61 to me and I wonder how to revive it for use in 2020. I've read some of the replies in this thread, and I don't get how a 16:10 T61p motherboard fits into a 4:3 R61 chassis (how does a rectangular mobo fit into a square body)? Am I missing something here? What about the alignment of the ports? Are they exactly the same? Would the results (would it even work?) be the same if I put in a 14.0-screen, 4:3 T61 mobo into my 15.0-screen, 4:3 R61 chassis? How will the ports from a smaller mobo emerge from a larger chassis? Do I need to modify something?

[atagunov]

... R61 ... and I wonder how to revive it for use in 2020

Hi there! In my view 8Gb is a must to make a machine useful in 2020. In either case you need DDR2. If I were you I'd start by checking how much it costs and if you want to go for this project I paid £84 for 8Gb DDR2 recently

I've read some of the replies in this thread

So you're are probably aware that you don't have to replace a mobo to make the machine useful, right? R61 has a fine motherboard. You can put 8Gb RAM in. You can put better processor in. There may be some contrived ways to get 1066FSB processors to run and perhaps even a 4 core QX9300.. At least this is what veterans of this forum are telling us

The only reason to replace the motherboard it seems is if you feel that you have to have an nVidia graphics card rather than an Intel one. And if you're going to do that you got to be aware of the issues with nVidia cards on T61 boards and the crucial importance of 08/08 production date on TYPE sticker on the bottom and of NOS option which may still be slightly available.. You're aware of all that, right?

and I don't get how a 16:10 T61p motherboard fits into a 4:3 R61 chassis (how does a rectangular mobo fit into a square body)? Am I missing something here? What about the alignment of the ports? Are they exactly the same?

Not just any 16:10 T61p but a 15.4" 16:10 T61p. 14.1" 16:10 T61p mobo is not suitable. BTW look at both T61p and T61. There shouldn't be that much diff.

Then.. just look at the photos, mate I'm less sure about R61 since all my attention was on T61/T60. For T61/T60 there is a nearly ideal match on port placement between 16:10 15.4" T61 mobo and a 15" 4:3 T60. Except for the modem which allegedly can be broken off the motherboard. I've heard that you still need to do a lot of cutting with a Dremal and diamond disks to get that 16:10 15.4" T61 mobo into a 15" 4:3 T60 though. And you have to be creative since your HDD bay is no longer big enough for a normal SSD. And your DVD starts sticking out a couple of cm and is no longer locked in place so it's probably better to remove it entirely.

Would the results (would it even work?) be the same if I put in a 14.0-screen, 4:3 T61 mobo into my 15.0-screen, 4:3 R61 chassis? How will the ports from a smaller mobo emerge from a larger chassis? Do I need to modify something?

If it was a T60 we were talking about not R61 I would have told you that a 14" 4:3 T61 mobo fits into 15" 4:3 T60 much easier than a 15.4 16:10 one. Still a little to cut with dremel but an easier fit. This is because a 15" 4:3 T60 is essentially using a 14" 4:3 T60 board with a little extender ("interposter") board. But I don't know how things stand for a 15" 4:3 R61 and if it's got a similar "interposter" board.. Perhaps you can consult the HMM or open your machine up.. and tell me so that I finally know